Garratt

[Mark Scotney]

Hi all, anyone know if it's possible to purchase a rtr garratt?, I do not believe I have the skill to make up a kit.
Many thanks Mark S

[JulienW]

It certainly possible but they don't come up that often as you'd probably be looking at something someone had built for their own use but had decided to sell on (changing scale or otherwise giving up 009). The other suggestion would be to pay someone to build one of the kits for you.

Which of the Garratt kits did you have in mind? 

From memory there are currently 4,and these are:

The Golden Arrow K1 - a white metal kit designed for two of the Ibertren 0-4-0 chassis. Whilst the kit is still in production (on a limited basis) the chassis are hard to get, though Golden Arrow also do a set of etched parts to make a pair of chassis, and it may be possible to modify the kit to take the Fleischmann 0-4-0 or a pair of N-Drive chassis that should be easier to get, especially the N-Drive as these are made to order.

Backwoods Miniatures etched kits for the K1, Darjeeling D class and the South African NGG-16.  These have been out of production for a number of years so tend to command 'collectors prices' when they do appear, and the Backwoods kits are not the easiest of kits to build (though not impossible given enough care in the building).

There are also 2 that I know of on Shapeways as 3D prints and there may be others. One of the "Puffing Billy" G class 2-6-0+0-6-2 in HO scale designed for a pair of Farish 08 chassis, but you need to buy the sections as individual kits (I think 3 or 4 to make the whole loco) and it doesn't work out all that cheap. The same designer also offers a 4 mm version scaled up from the HO one, but chassis for that may be an issue as the holes for the Farish 08 will be too big (from the 114%  enlargement from HO to OO), and being a 'Colonial 2' 6" prototype' might be hard to fit through the average 009 loading gauge. There is also an NGG16 kit (again for the Farish 08), but from what I've heard from someone who did try one there wasn't much left of the 3D print by the time the builder was happy with the finished loco.

From what I've seen of the Golden Arrow K1, and having built some of his other kits that one shouldn't be too hard, and could be glued together rather than soldered.  The main issue with that kit is the lack of Ibertren chassis (these have been out of production for many years now) so if you decided to give that kit a go I'd suggest getting hold of a pair of chassis first, and that new N-Drive chassis might be the way to go (compared to 2nd hand 'used and abused' Ibertrens or Fleischmanns).  I suspect that some modifications to the kit will be needed to fit these (or any other) alternative chassis and these are probably easier to do on an unbuilt kit.

There is also the possibility of scratch building one in plastic (if you break a Garratt down you have in essence 2 boxes for the front and rear tanks and a tube for the boiler), and for possible chassis units I'd suggest going to N-Drive again, as one can specify that the motor and cylinders are at the same end of the chassis so on the model they end up on the 'outer' ends of the power units, just like most of the Garratts built (the exceptions being K1 and sister K2).

Working along similar lines I seem to recall someone building a fictional "K3" using the Golden Arrow kit but with the cylinders in the usual Garratt position (outer ends).

Remember that you don't know for certain you can't do anything unless you try at least once, and in my experience I've learnt more from making mistakes than getting it right first time. And however long it takes it will be worth the effort!

Hope that helps,
Julien

[MickT]

There's no "RTR" Garratts available in the sense of a manufacturer producing one in a box and you buy it ready to run, but it is possible to get a kit built one that somebody else with the necessary skills has made.

My "sources" have advised that there will shortly be "more than one" Garratt loco, either scratchbuilt or built from Backwoods kits by an expert skilled modeller available via 009 Society Sales. You won't be able to reserve so need to keep an eye on the online sales listing via the Society website and be prepared to get your order, or bid if they go up for auction  in fast. You should also be warned that you will need a very healthy wallet to secure items of this nature! Bear in mind that an unmade Backwoods NGG16 kit, if you can find one, will probably fetch several hundred pounds on eBay!

(building a pugbash with a Dapol pug kit and a pre-loved but good condition 4 or 6 wheel chassis will provide you with a working loco for no more than about £50 all-in, possibly less, will give you hours of fun and will be all your own work without you having to have a degree in model engineering skills, maybe worth considering adjusting your shopping list!!)

Good luck!

Mick

[Peter Boulter]

Hi Mark.

Pete Bullimore built a nice looking freelance garret, using 2x Kato 103 chassis I think. If you're on Facebook have a look though the photos on the 009 railway modelling group.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/2122496201296687/

I always thought that scratchbuilding locos was way beyond my modeling ability. But during the big lockdown I decided that rather than buy a new loco I'd try and build one. I had a spare Kato 110 chassis, some plastic cars and had lots of spare time and if it went horribly wrong what could I lose? I could use the 110 for a 3D body.
The build went better than I thought and I've now built three locos, OK, they're not the best model locos in the world but they look quite nice (to me at least).

So, have a go at building your own. There's something very satisfying about watching a loco you've build running on your layout.

[clayliner]

As Mick says, if you wait until the next issue of the News (February's issue, due out towards the end of January), and keep an eye on online Society Sales, you may well see something you like. Though - again, as Mick says - they don't come very cheap, but then I wouldn't expect anyone to think they would be!

David.

[B.Meldon]

If you want to purchase a well-made, painted, and good running version of the 009 Backwoods NGG16 Garratt kit they you are looking at paying around £500 or more.
The same approx. price as purchasing the kit and getting it professionally made.
However these are very few and far between now and as time goes on the price will only go up.

As mentioned above you just need to watch the 009 Society sales and e-bay for examples.

Brian Meldon

[MickT]

If you want to purchase a well-made, painted, and good running version of the 009 Backwoods NGG16 Garratt kit they you are looking at paying around £500 or more.
The same approx. price as purchasing the kit and getting it professionally made.
However these are very few and far between now and as time goes on the price will only go up.

I think you are already out of date on this Brian. I've seen reports of unmade Backwoods NGG16 kits going at near or even above the price you mentioned and I would not be at all surprised to see a NGG16 well made to professional standards including faultless running and top quality paint job fetching nearer to 4 figures. From a personal point of view, that is getting into the sort of territory I value cars at and my parents valued house purchase at, so I will stick to scrap box modelling!

Mick
Mick

[engerth399]

Julien said: Remember that you don't know for certain you can't do anything unless you try at least once, and in my experience I've learnt more from making mistakes than getting it right first time. And however long it takes it will be worth the effort!

Oh so true -Very good advice.

Peter

[clayliner]

Let's say £5-800 plus for a quality model...

David.

[MickT]

Let's say £5-800 plus for a quality model...

David.

I'll have the £5 one in that case please. Take it off what you already owe me and I'll keep an eye on the post next week.

Happy Christmas!

Mick

[Mark Scotney]

Many thanks to you all for the comments, certainly some food for thought. Being a very recent member of the society and convert from 00, I am coming to terms with the world of 009. It's limitations but also it's opportunities. Very much looking forward to the journey.

[Julian Evison]

Welcome Mark!

To pick up on what Julien said about the Golden Arrow K1 kit, the body is easy to put together even if you prefer to use epoxy ratehr than solder the whitemetal parts and the result is rather nice. As he aslo said it is designed for the Ibertren Cuckoo chassis (long unavailable). I've been trying to get mine to fit the Fleischmann 7000 0-4-0T, but without success - I think I will be have to build new front and back tank sides to get it to fit.

Julian

[The Sales Team]

I'll have the £5 one in that case please. Take it off what you already owe me and I'll keep an eye on the post next week.   Happy Christmas!   Mick

Sorry to disappoint you, Mick - someone got careless with the pricing gun so it's been withdrawn from sale (as the retailer is entitled to do) and has reappeared with a couple of noughts on the end.

Is it true you can buy a house down there in Wales for less?

I'll let you get back to discussing scales/gauges on NGRM (those thread keep a certain sort of modeller happy for weeks...)

David.

[JulienW]

Welcome Mark!

To pick up on what Julien said about the Golden Arrow K1 kit, the body is easy to put together even if you prefer to use epoxy ratehr than solder the whitemetal parts and the result is rather nice. As he aslo said it is designed for the Ibertren Cuckoo chassis (long unavailable). I've been trying to get mine to fit the Fleischmann 7000 0-4-0T, but without success - I think I will be have to build new front and back tank sides to get it to fit.

Julian

Having thought a little about chassis over Christmas I was struck by a photo one of the West Mids Group members emailed to me showing one of the Fleishmann 0-4-0 chassis alongside one of the new Bachman N-scale 'Percy' Locos which suggests that the new Bachman chassis might be a possible candidate - the drawback is that the chassis isn't available on its own and the locos seem to be retailing in the £80-100 bracket, which given the prices of the N-drive chassis (£45-50 iirc for a brand new chassis) and the sums that the Iberteren (£50+ for a second or third hand one on eBay) and Fleischmann (similar sort of price range on eBay) seems a bit steep.

Personally my money would be on the N-drive, which although it might take a while for your order to be built have, in my opinion, been worth the wait (and Neville will not take payment until they are ready for delivery).

[Julian Evison]

Having thought a little about chassis over Christmas I was struck by a photo one of the West Mids Group members emailed to me showing one of the Fleishmann 0-4-0 chassis alongside one of the new Bachman N-scale 'Percy' Locos which suggests that the new Bachman chassis might be a possible candidate - the drawback is that the chassis isn't available on its own and the locos seem to be retailing in the £80-100 bracket, which given the prices of the N-drive chassis (£45-50 iirc for a brand new chassis) and the sums that the Iberteren (£50+ for a second or third hand one on eBay) and Fleischmann (similar sort of price range on eBay) seems a bit steep.

Personally my money would be on the N-drive, which although it might take a while for your order to be built have, in my opinion, been worth the wait (and Neville will not take payment until they are ready for delivery).

Thanks Julien. I bought a couple of the Bachmann Percys, but the gear train comes too far forward to allow the pivot point on the K1 to be anywhere sensible, so they won't work. The Percy's have subsequently been sold on.

Julian