Narrow gauge atmosphere

[Stephen Rainsbury]

For me it is the impression that the line was built and maintained by some very ingenious people working with a minimal budget. No unnecessary frills or  luxuries, just enough to get the job done.

Edit: Maybe that should read "British Narrow Gauge... "

[Peter Boulter]

For me it is the impression that the line was built and maintained by some very ingenious people working with a minimal budget. No unnecessary frills or  luxuries, just enough to get the job done.

I think that's one of the best answers so far.

[Hobby]

I'd agree that is what many British NG enthusiasts believe, and it's seen in comments I've seen on forums and in magazines where networks such as the Cape Gauge railways and Swiss Metre gauge are called standard gauge in miniature (as if true narrow gauge can't be run efficiently!) and the only true narrow gauge is a line run on a minimum budget and run into the ground.

Which is exactly why I was trying to persuade people that isn't the case! It seems a very British attitude to narrow gauge, probably because that's how our narrow gauge lines were, but, as such, it's also a very insular view of narrow gauge and one I'd hope the Society's publication wold not perpetuate.

Looks like I'm flogging a dead horse, though, as I seem to be the only one who doesn't want my model railway to be run down and decrepit!



(David, my views on O scale narrow gauge modelling is based on the layouts I see at exhibitions which would appear in the main to be either small British run down NG (see Tallylyn reference in a previous post!) using cheap Hornby 0-4-0 chassis, Industrial narrow gauge or US Logging lines - I could be doing them a major dis-service in which case I apologise, but that's the impression I get - I think one reason we see much more foreign HO narrow gauge is because it is available RTR, something that hasn't been the case in 0 scale, except for the short lived and crude Magic Train and Minex ranges).

[Peter Boulter]

Looks like I'm flogging a dead horse, though, as I seem to be the only one who doesn't want my model railway to be run down and decrepit!

You're not alone. My model railway is neither run down or decrepit.

[JulienW]

There are probably as many 'atmospheres' as there are narrow gauge railways (quite a few around the world!), and I suspect that the atmosphere of any particular line changed with time - as a case in point I suspect the 'atmosphere' of the Tallylyn was different if one were to compare the 1950s to the current preserved line.

It might be possible to define this 'atmosphere', but I suspect that once we get past the very definition of narrow gauge - that the rails are closer than 4' 8 1/2" or 1435mm - it's unlikely more than one person will agree on whatever definition anyone else comes up with.

I've often said that when it comes to narrow gauge modelers we tend to be "Narrow gauge, not narrow minded", so perhaps we should confine ourselves to agreeing that narrow gauge railways are just "not standard", and the slick Swiss meter gauge is atmospheric, and the Tralee & Dingle running monthly cattle trains with broken-down truck and barely running locomotives is also atmospheric, and the only definite obvious difference is about 3 inches?.

(Equally I thought the only Atmospheric railway in the UK was 7' gauge... ::)

[Hobby]

I've often said that when it comes to narrow gauge modelers we tend to be "Narrow gauge, not narrow minded", so perhaps we should confine ourselves to agreeing that narrow gauge railways are just "not standard", and the slick Swiss meter gauge is atmospheric, and the Tralee & Dingle running monthly cattle trains with broken-down truck and barely running locomotives is also atmospheric, and the only definite obvious difference is about 3 inches?.

Well said, young sir... It begs the question, though, why do we have to try to define NG atmosphere, it would be like herding cats! Perhaps a few comments from people why they model what they do but not trying to nail down something so slippery (perhaps not cats, then!)...

Has anyone seen the 7mmNG article, I would love to see what they've said (and whether it backs my suspicions!) but I'm not joining them simply for that!!

[Stephen Rainsbury]

Looks like I'm flogging a dead horse, though, as I seem to be the only one who doesn't want my model railway to be run down and decrepit!

I have changed my comment to say "British Narrow Gauge.."

[engerth399]

 It begs the question, though, why do we have to try to define NG atmosphere

This is the nub of it - once you define narrow gauge atmosphere anyone not conforming is beyond the pail.  One thing narrow gauge enthusiasts are is non-conformist (obviously not in any relgious sense).  We whave seen the different viewpoints and it is obvious that Cape Gauge or Indian metre gauge main lines bear little relationship with a Welsh slate line.

[clayliner]

...why do we have to try to define NG atmosphere, it would be like herding cats!

No one is forcing you, Blair! If you recall my OP was only quoting the review in the latest News where the reviewer said that Gordon Gravett et al were explaining 'how they capture that elusive narrow gauge 'atmosphere' '- so maybe we should just read the book to find their answer?  :)

The key word is probably 'elusive' - herding cats, nailing jelly to the wall and other similar expressions may indeed apply here.

The key thing may just be that, whatever it is, we recognise it when we see it?

David.

[Hobby]

We were asked whether we should do something similar for the upcoming Society Handbook, all I was doing was pointing out that the typical British view of what "NG Atmosphere" is very different to what other people may think, and I felt that we should not perpetuate the myth that there is only "one true version" of it and suggested that we should be trying to celebrate the wide variety of different atmospheres, not just one...

Unless you want to just change the title to "British Narrow Gauge Atmosphere"!

[Graeme Dunbar]

Since "atmosphere" is such an emotive term then approaching the topic from another angle might be worth consideration?

I think what might be implied by "narrow gauge atmosphere" is what differentiates it from "standard gauge atmosphere", or at least as most people experience railways. In this case it could be approached by looking at differences and similarities and the reasons for them, a sort of "form follows function" view. That could also encompass differences between different types of NG railway, eras and locations. It could also cover things like the history of a line which might give a different "atmosphere" whether if say it was built in its final form or evolved from a horse-drawn tramway.

[Dave Cooper]

Hmm, this is like the proverbial 'bar-of-soap-in-the-bath' methinks.

When at an exhibition, I'm drawn to some exhibits more than others - regardless of scale /gauge etc. This could well be "atmosphere". For me, its usually the way the railway interacts with the setting (scenery ?), mixed in with some sense of purpose for the line. How you actually encapsulate this in any definition is beyond me.

Perhaps for the Society's guide, it might point the newcomer to a list of possible titles, eg the 7mm "Going Narrow Gauge", Slim Gauge publications etc. I think we may be only able to point the way... 

[Hobby]

I'd suggest people reading some of the books on NG written in the 1950s and early 1960s by people who visited those lines are much better at painting the "old style" NG atmosphere than those more recent publications...

But then there's the different atmosphere of modern commercial NG and heritage (preserved) NG which are different again...

As you say, a bar of soap in a bath, impossible to categorise...