Adding weight to my Baldwin Class 10-12-D 4-6-0T

[Tom Haythornthwaite]

My Baldwin Class 10-12-D would rather spin its wheels than pull four coaches.  Is there anything I might be doing wrong, or does it need more weight?  (Lightly pressing on the cab roof seems to help it grip.)

If I need to weight it, has anybody else done it yet?

[JulienW]

IIRC the prototype was rated to haul a maximum of 6 WD bogie wagons (about 10 tons each when loaded) but I think that was on the flat (& decently laid track).  Looking at the weights painted on the sides of the coaches on the W&LLR today they all seem to be about 15 tons per bogie coach so that would knock the WD Baldwin back to 4 on the flat, and probably 2 going up something like Golfa bank (i.e. 1 in 30).

It might depend on the coaches you are using - old GEM white metal ones or plastic Peco rtr jobs for example - whether you have added any weight to them (or not) and how free-running (or not) they are.  Equally and what (if any) gradient you are trying to run the train up will have an effect, and don't forget that if the transition between the flat track and the gradient is too abrupt the middle wheels of the loco will be lifted off the rail head, and with the design of the chassis (2 wheel pony truck and fixed carrying wheel in front of the 6 drivers) the 4-6-0 might find itself becoming a 4-2-0

You could add some weight to the loco - not sure where you'd put it - but do bear in mind that Bachmann will have designed the bearings in the loco to take the weight of the loco as standard, and adding weight may cause these to fail prematurely (and adding weight may well be a modification that will invalidate any guarrentee).

Might be easier to try 3 coaches instead....

[paul ludlow]

Hi, my Baldwin hauls my Dundas kit built coach and two peco l&b coaches round peco set track curves quite happily (admitidly on the flat). See it on u-tube "Somewhere in Kent 1950s". Paul.

[MickT]

IIRC the prototype was rated to haul a maximum of 6 WD bogie wagons (about 10 tons each when loaded) but I think that was on the flat (& decently laid track).  Looking at the weights painted on the sides of the coaches on the W&LLR today they all seem to be about 15 tons per bogie coach so that would knock the WD Baldwin back to 4 on the flat, and probably 2 going up something like Golfa bank (i.e. 1 in 30).

I think there's a danger it might fall into the sleepers as well, seeing as the 1:1 scale one is 6 inches under gauge for the WLLR.

Fear not, I'm not stopping for long, on my way over to the "other" forum

Mick

[jimowers]

Not being electronically literate in any way I asked someone with more knowledge to take a look at my two Baldwins with a view to adding more weight to them in order to reduce risk at exhibitions. He came up with a solution that involved stripping out the two electronics boards and rewiring the pickups directly to the motors on each of them. This still gives remarkably smooth running and at slow speed as well with a Gaugemaster W.

In addition, he has added a lot of lead when you think how tight the bodies are for space. Of course removing the electronics makes a lot more space as well and he has stuffed even more lead under the cab roofs. When he had completed this he got Hummy up to 86g total weight and, because of the open cab, Peggy is at 83g.

Running and traction are now much improved.

The chap I used is Mick Moignard who normally does DCC conversions but may well be willing to help others. He is often at exhibitions but anyone who is unable to get in touch may contact me via PM as a last resort. Hope that helps.

[MickT]

To supplement Jim's posting above, Mick Moignard is a very accomplished modeller and an active member of the Slim Gauge Circle and is usually to be found on the demonstration and publicity stand that the Circle set up at most NG model railway events and many of the mainstream ones as well.

Mick

[rod335]

Can't help wondering if we are having unrealistic expectations of these marvellous little locos. The real thing was not enormously powerful and nothing should be expected to haul much weight round 9" radius curves and up 1 in 20 gradients.

[MickT]

Can't help wondering if we are having unrealistic expectations of these marvellous little locos. The real thing was not enormously powerful and nothing should be expected to haul much weight round 9" radius curves and up 1 in 20 gradients.

Very timely and realistic warning Rod. This harks back to 30 years or so ago when 009 whitemetal kits first appeared and was followed a couple of years later by a rash of reports of "useless N gauge chassis" and gear stripping, motors burned out etc etc - directly attributed to the excessive weighting that was crammed in to the already over design weight of the whitemetal body on top of the chassis in attempts to increase adhesion and hauling power.

Mick

[jimowers]

As I mentioned, my main aim was to improve reliability at exhibitions. Rather than overloading trains. All our layout is on the flat and even one or two coaches was giving wheel slip. This is not much improved. Richard Glover also reported on another forum that some controllers give odd results with these Baldwins, possibly due to the electronics in the blanking plugs. Removing the electronic gubbins solved that problem as well and I now have two excellent little locos.

[Kevin Martin]

As I mentioned, my main aim was to improve reliability at exhibitions. Rather than overloading trains. All our layout is on the flat and even one or two coaches was giving wheel slip. This is not much improved. Richard Glover also reported on another forum that some controllers give odd results with these Baldwins, possibly due to the electronics in the blanking plugs. Removing the electronic gubbins solved that problem as well and I now have two excellent little locos.

The capacitor that is fitted to the DCC blanking plug in this loco, is apparently far to high to work correctly with PWM type controllers. Apparently, it has a value of approx 4.7 uF, whereas, the recommended value for Use with PWM is approx 100 nF (approx 100 times less then the one fitted.).

I had mine changed to the 'correct' value and it now works well with my Bluerailways controller.

BTW, I know nothing about electronics, I'm just quoting what I was told :)

Kevin

[jimowers]

As I mentioned, my main aim was to improve reliability at exhibitions. Rather than overloading trains. All our layout is on the flat and even one or two coaches was giving wheel slip. This is now much improved. Richard Glover also reported on another forum that some controllers give odd results with these Baldwins, possibly due to the electronics in the blanking plugs. Removing the electronic gubbins solved that problem as well and I now have two excellent little locos.

[Martin Collins]

I too had problems with the haulage power/traction on the Baldwin, and having removed the tanks, took one look at the pcb that was on view and decided I hadn't got a clue where to start if I wanted to remove it.  Far too scary!
However, I did manage to squeeze in a little piece of thin lead around the casting that bears the pcb, and also a small piece, carefully chamfered top and rear glued to either side of the cab.  It didn't transform it, but it helped.
The problem of course, is that you need the weight over the drivers, and there just isn't room, so equal amounts in front and behind is the best you can do.
Incidentally, despite undoing all the obvious screws, I couldn't find how to remove the cab, without converting the entire loco into a kit.  Have I missed something?

Martin