Travel question, which show??

[Andrew Emery]

That would indicate that the "quality" at the AGM is less than that at Expong

Yes

[Hobby]

Its different, Andrew, not worse.

[rod335]

I don't think being judgmental is particularly appropriate here. If I had to sum up Expong I would say 'The best esoteric trade support of any show, too many booksellers, a lot of really excellent European models but not to my taste and not enough layouts generally. But those are observations, not criticisms. All shows have their own individual flavours.

[JulienW]

The 'quality' of a layout surely must depend to an extent on who is looking at it, and is therefore somewhat subjective?

In the fist post  Jim asked (my bold)

<snipped>
If there were only one show you could attend in a given year, which would include the most 009 exposure? By that, I mean regarding 009 layouts, dealers, mfrs and vendors whose focus is big in 009.

So, on the assumption that 009 is Jim's main interest then the show with the maximum amount of 009 (certainly as a % of the total layouts and probably number of 009 layouts too) in 2018 is more likely to be Narrow Gauge South (incorporating the 009 Society's AGM )at Eastleigh in April as opposed to ExpoNG in October, and most of the 009-centric manufacturers/dealers will (probably) be at both shows.

[Andrew Emery]

Its different, Andrew, not worse.

Nobody said "worse". Let's not start adding words that were never used.

[Andrew Emery]

Jim,

Like you, I live thousands of miles away from the UK. Like you, I need to make judgement calls on what to visit and when.

In 2016 I flew to the UK and attended ExpoNG in Kent, whilst staying in London. The layouts were first-rate, the selection of traders was impressive, the venue was good, transportation from London was good and not to expensive or far. In short, I had a good experience and felt the trip worthwhile.

I also flew to the UK for the AGM. It was in a remote village, difficult to get to. There were traders, but space was at a premium - the venue had to be split between two sites due to lack of suitability of either for such an event. One part was not at the advertised location - it had been moved. A surprising number of exhibits were not of exhibition quality. (By the way, I would never exhibit my models because I know that nothing I produce is of exhibition quality, so let's put that one to bed before the Trolls start with it).

In short, I was unhappy with my AGM experience, with getting there, with getting back from where it was, and with what it was. By contrast, ExpoNG I enjoyed thoroughly.

I hope this assists you.

Kind Regards,
Andrew

[Hobby]

OK but it's best not to judge on just one exhibition especially as the AGM is hosted by different Groups each year so will vary. Certainly the last time the group who are holding it this year put the AGM it was a first class show... I have to ask if you've been to an AGM hosted by this years organisers or are you basing it one one negative trip to a show run by another group?

(As regards the word "worse" it was you that negatively compared the AGM to Expo, not me, whilst you didn't use the word "worse" you did say one was not as good as the other which is the same thing! I just pointed out that it's different!!) :)

Actually there are many NG shows organised by local groups over the year so dependant on when Jim comes over he could fit in more than one so that's also worth considering. Also does he like talking to fellow OO9 modellers, if so a local group show or the AGM may be a better bet than a general NG show like Expo... Other things he needs to think about!

[Andrew Emery]

Jim,

My first AGM was at The Viking Hotel in York I think, about 1985.

There is little tolerance for differing opinion in this forum, you will find.

Kindest,
Andrew

[Hobby]

That's a very unfair comment, Andrew. Are we not allowed to express a view contrary to yours?

What I and others have said is that Expo and the AGM are different types of show. Expo covers all scales of NG modelling like NG South West used to and some others like NG North still do whereas the AGM is aimed at OO9 modellers in particular. It depends on what Jim wants from his visit. I would agree that Expo is very good at some things but a Group show or the AGM are very good at others, but is one "better" than another, I don't think so.

I've been to many shows over the years, as well as organising many, and I would say that they all offer something different. Yes you can get many different standards of modelling, but that reflects the Membership of the Society and the local group. Having said that the standard at the AGMs tend to be fine, certainly at the last one in 2017 that I attended was easily on a par with the 2016 Expo...

Blair

[Andrew Emery]

That's a very unfair comment, Andrew. Are we not allowed to express a view contrary to yours?

What I and others have said is that Expo and the AGM are different types of show. Expo covers all scales of NG modelling like NG South West used to and some others like NG North still do whereas the AGM is aimed at OO9 modellers in particular. It depends on what Jim wants from his visit. I would agree that Expo is very good at some things but a Group show or the AGM are very good at others, but is one "better" than another, I don't think so.

I've been to many shows over the years, as well as organising many, and I would say that they all offer something different. Yes you can get many different standards of modelling, but that reflects the Membership of the Society and the local group. Having said that the standard at the AGMs tend to be fine, certainly at the last one in 2017 that I attended was easily on a par with the 2016 Expo...

Blair

Ironically, that is exactly my point. I (or perhaps others, elsewhere) post for positive reasons, and rather than expressing a contrasting opinion, which would be reasonable, certain persons chose to attack that posting.

I'm having nothing further to do with this subject, and will not be checkng this thread again, so go ahead and enjoy. I am sure Jim is mightily impressed.

[Hobby]

Jim, perhaps it's worth pointing out that there are several different types of NG show, which is what this thread has shown!

At one end there is the more commercial "general" NG show such as Expong, NG North and NG Tewksbury. They cater for all types of NG model railway enthusiast and get support from manufacturers from all scales and have layouts that reflect this. Of them Expong is currently the best. They can get very busy dependent on the size of the hall, rather like a normal large show.

The Society AGM is usually as large as the above but is, as would be expected, geared towards those of us who model in 4mm scale or less. It can have layouts in other scales but trade support is mainly from and for OO9 Modellers and layouts are mainly in the scales the Society support.

At the other end of the scale is the local Group show which can be either classified as a Members Day or an Exhibition depending on the organisers. They are a very different kettle of fish, small (generally around 10 or so layouts, some more, some less), trade support but not the full works and the Society Secondhand Stall. They are aimed at getting together NG modellers with like minds and the atmosphere tends to reflect that, very friendly, can be busy (Pewsey!), the AGM on a smaller scale.

There is a more recent type of gathering which two or three Groups have done which is the "open day", "works day" or whatever they call it which is not an exhibition as such but a meeting to show off people's work and get tips on various aspects of the hobby, East Midlands did one as have (I think!) SWOONS. Very good but for your purpose perhaps not what you are after.

I've tried to be as even handed as I can with the above, which you prefer very much depends on what you want to get from your visit, and I hope the above helps you make up your mind. Ideally I would suggest a visit to Expong, the AGM and at least one Members Day but as two are at opposite ends of the year that isn't going to happen!

Good luck!

[Jim Flynn]

Folks, sorry I have not posted any reply the last few days, things got sort of off kilter here a bit, hobby stuff was shoved aside somewhat. I'm off to work in a few, but will post my thoughts later today (I hope), tomorrow at the latest.

Thanks for the input.

Jim

[Jim Flynn]

I did realize, in asking my question, that I would get varied answers, and that folks replying would give their reasons for which show they recommended.

What I had not meant to do was to get anyone's knickers in a twist. It seems Andrew's did. I appreciate his input, but it seems he does not take well to folks disagreeing with him. Perhaps his oft mention of 'trolls' is indicative of his opinion of many on here? I am sorry he felt he had to leave the discussion.

As for the shows, I am leaning towards the NG South, in Eastleigh, for exactly the reasons given by Hobby and Julien, in particular.

My interests in going to a show would be: A) 009 UK themed NG layouts B) Traders, vendors, etc.., whose main focus is 009. Other than that, the only other interests would be UK themed 7mm NG layouts.

It will sound parochial, but I have zero interest in European rail, whether standard or NG, in any scale and really not much interest in any UK modelling in any scale other than 4mm and 7mm. So, at a show such as ExpoNG, anything not related to UK NG in 4mm (and maybe 7mm) would be a waste of my visit time.

One other item, at NG South, with it being the Society's AGM, I might meet a few more members, to put faces to names, than I would at the Expo.

Jim

[Hobby]

Jim once you decide on a date it may be worth you keeping your eye on the Society Diary (on the website) and the UKModelshops Exhibition Guide if you are over for a few weeks, there may be other shows worth going to that are not NG specific but have something you'd like...

http://www.ukmodelshops.co.uk/events

[rod335]

Some 60 odd years ago there was a spate of correspondence in the RM about joining clubs, 'was it worth it', 'my experiences were not good' etc. I think I recall someone suggesting the problem was that some people are just not 'clubbable'. Seems to me that might still apply.