Forum demise, part II

[Jim Flynn]

Instead of continuing this in the Sales sub-forum, I have posted it here. (Note, I didn't post my original here, based on it not being a prototype discussion, per the section's description)

The Yahoo group's coming demise has been discussed, the prime reason given is lack of participation. A poll was sent out, a few responded, all voting that it close. If I had been a member, i would have voted for it to remain, as it does not cost anything. I would also have suggested that it be set so folks will find it if the are searching for 009 related groups. I know I had searched, a couple of times over the years, and never found it. I did not know it existed, until I joined the Society, and saw it mentioned on here.

I don't know what the message count was during it's better days, but looking at this forum's numbers, if one takes the posting count at the bottom of the page, and divides it by 8 years, it comes to about 4.5 messages per day. Not what I would call a large amount of traffic.

With the NG subforum on RMweb, and the stand alone NG Forum, I am actually surprised the Society is willing to foot the bill for this forum, given it's level of activity.

And now adding in FB, I will guess there will be less traffic. It was stated that the FB page would be only for announcements, to try and entice folks to explore 009 modeling, and perhaps join the forum. But I just had my second look at it, and all I see for the last several days is modeling posts by various folks, so I guess the 'announcement's only' idea is out the window.

Perhaps the forum should just be trimmed back to just Society issues (though a sub section for new folks to post a intro would be a good addition), and then let the members post and read modeling info on other locations, that they prefer more.

Just thought...

Jim F

[Darren Hedges]

There are no modeling posts on the Society Facebook page, I think you may have been looking at the '009 Railway Modellers' Group which is not affiliated to the Society, though many of it's members are also Society members too.

Regards,
Darren.

[Hobby]

as it does not cost anything

Yes it does, it still needs someone to monitor it, just like any forum does. May not be a monetary cost, but certainly someone's leisure time will be eaten up looking after it.

I find that all forums/FB/Yahoo set-ups tend to duplicate each other with many of us posting the same materiel on all of them. For that reason i only tend to use NGRM, RMWeb and NRM (more a SG forum) for posts on my modelling.

Both FB and Yahoo are far too "scatter" for my liking, I prefer sites where I can easily find out information and it's presented in a logical manner, FB and Yahoo don't do that. They are fine for general discussion on what is going on at a particular time but a nightmare for the storing or or recovery of useful information.

[Jim Flynn]

Darren,

My error, you are correct. I used the link in the other thread, thinking it was to the Society's page.

Hobby, whoever, I own one yahoo group, and am a mod on 2 others. My time involved is so minimal, as to be not worth mentioning. Mainly, it is approving any new member, and once in a great while, having to put someone in Moderated status, after their email has been hacked, and the group gets a questionable posting. It is not any sort of time consuming task.

I agree, finding past info on yahoo groups can be a chore, but at least, when I search, if it's there, I find it. One issue with forums is when you hunt down info you want or need, and find all the attached/imbedded pictures are gone, as they are hosted elsewhere, and the owner has moved them, abandoned or deleted the account, or the hosting site has made changes.

To each their own. For me, Yahoo still wins, as I can get the email messages via my phone or tablet, and do not have to be at my comp, files and photos get saved in one location, and who can join can be much more closely monitored.

Jim F

[Frank]

For what it's worth, I find this forum both useful and interesting.

I am not a luddite nor technophobe, I was online with a 300 baud dialup modem before the World Wide Web appeared, but I have closed my facebook account because of privacy and security concerns and do not have a Yahoo membership for similar reasons.

Forums like this should be cherished.  They provide a place for like minded individuals to discuss their interest without being bothered by wider concerns.

Frank

[jimowers]

I am another member who started in very early on the internet and I have closed all Facebook, Yahoo and similar services for the very same reasons of security.

Whatever happens I shall stick to the traditional forum technology as this is, in my view, much safer all round. It also has the benefit of being less immediate than Facebook and Twitter and suchlike and so people have time to think before they present their views to the World at large.

[Hobby]

I agree, finding past info on yahoo groups can be a chore, but at least, when I search, if it's there, I find it. One issue with forums is when you hunt down info you want or need, and find all the attached/imbedded pictures are gone, as they are hosted elsewhere, and the owner has moved them, abandoned or deleted the account, or the hosting site has made changes.

Fair comment re photos, but re your other point you can still access forums on modern smart phones. I was posting on NGRM for the last two weeks using mine!

As you say it's down to personal choice, but for clarity and ease of use I find a Forum much better. It's set out like a book, with a Contents Page, Chapters and an Index so easy to navigate. Yahoo and FB don't even come close...

Give me NGRM and this forum over them any day! :)

[MickT]

This topic seems to have drifted a bit into an airing of views regarding yahoo/facebook vs forums in general, so to get back to the original posting regarding the 009 yahoo group:

It appears to have been overlooked slightly that the group ceased to be "the official Society group" (sic) back in 2008, 8 years ago, but because several people voiced concerns, indeed dissent, at the time about it being closed down, one member volunteered to keep it open as an independent group, not affiliated to the Society at all, but with his own condition that people joining the Group should be members of the Society. A very creditable voluntary service offered to those Society members who wanted the Yahoo Group to continue.

Since then postings on the group have steadily declined and as we all know it culminated recently with statistics showing that virtually nobody was posting at all so Julien quite rightly made the decision to cease running the group and close it down. He was not obligated to make any announcements in advance nor was he obligated to run a poll to see if there was still interest but to his credit he did so and the democratic voice of the members of the group was absolutely clear. 126 members and only a tiny number voted, unanimously as it turned out, to call it a day.

That's fine, however as one or two people have now voiced concerns about it and one or two have also stated that they didn't even know the group existed, I don't believe it is fair to expect Julien to change his mind as a result. The solution is clear, if there are members who still prefer to use Yahoo Groups then it is quite a straightforward task to set a new group up and as has been pointed out, it is free financially, it just requires time and commitment from the group owner.

I think this subject should be laid to rest and Julien should be thanked for his commitment over the years in keeping what is clearly a defunct facility alive for so long and if somebiody else wants to start a new group, I'm sure that some people will emerge who are prepared to join it.

Mick

[Darren Hedges]

I think Mick has hit the nail on the head there.

The 009 Yahoo group is not an official part of the Society anymore (unlike this forum), and hasn't been for years. As such it is at the owners (Julien) discretion whether the group continues of closes.

Anyone who now voices concerns has effectively missed the boat, and should have posted said concerns on the yahoo group itself (plenty of notice was given) and voted in the poll.

Sorry to be blunt, but that's how I see it.

Lastly, I would like to thank Julien for his work running the Yahoo group all these years.

Regards,
Darren.

[Jim Flynn]

I agree, the issue is pretty much past. And yes, Julien should be thanked for mainlining it, but form personal experience, that effort is minimal. 

I was not advocating the group stay open, just commenting that perhaps it would have been a bit more active after the Society cut ties with it, if folks had been aware of it. I did not know of it's existence, despites searching Yahoo groups several times in the past few years, until I saw it mentioned on here. So it seems no one wanted it to be found.

I suppose it's just me, missing the days when one could find most of one's hobby interest in one location, be it Yahoo, a forum, or some other site. Now, one must look at this forum, RMweb, the NG forum, facebook, et al, for one's fix.

Such is life. Back to my work desk.

Jim F

[JulienW]

Just catching up after a week away with very limited internet access.

Thanks for all the thanks from those of you who are (or were) members of the 009 Group on Yahoo.

As I have pointed out elsewhere on this forum there is nothing stopping anyone from setting up a replacement for the soon-to-close 009 group on Yahoo.

Personally I feel that even the 'minimal' effort involved no longer justifies the Yahoo group's continued existence, but good luck to anyone who wishes to take up the challenge, as after all the 009 Society is run by volunteers who are willing to do their various Society jobs.

[EDGOZ2WAR]

I think the saying goes "use it or lose it". As the originator of the Facebook group 009 Railway Modellers and joint editor of the official 009 Society Facebook page I believe that social media and forums offer different ways of people enjoying our hobby. The 009 Railway modellers group is (as one of the admins has put it) a virtual club room. Show and tell, how do I make this work? and best of all we can watch videos of a layout in an exhibition we can't get too and most of the time you can get involved from wherever you are via a tablet or smart phone. Both Darren and Stephen have already said that the 009 society's FB page is for events and news and hopefully we can attract new members through it. As for forums....I haven't posted on here in a long, long time but it doesn't mean that I think they should disappear. Many people don't like or use Facebook and for them forums are their way of getting to show off their work or ask questions.As far as I'm concerned at the end of the day whichever we use promoting our hobby and the society is the most important thing.