Glen Ogle

[gtmspyder]

Two base boards assembled for the Glen, all held together with screws at the moment as I am awaiting the delivery of dowels and clips from Ebay.

The boards will be dismantled and the end profiles drilled together for the dowels, and then cut to the Glen side shape that I established while the base board was temporarily screwed together.

This was required because the track-bed rises at 1 in30 and has a bend in the middle along this 8ft making it very difficult to establish the track-bed line on the open top baseboard.

The master board at the head of the Glen has four temporary legs attached to test the height, these will be adjusted for height, braced, jointed and hinged to the base board when boards are reassembled with glued joints.

The mess that is my garage with the master baseboard.



And the two baseboards stacked one above the other.



The main bearers of the base boards are 2" x 1" pine softwood, made up into "L" girders by gluing and screwing two pieces together, with 2"x1" cross pieces, and profile boards of 6mm MDF at each end.

There will be several other profile pieces along each 4ft length, made up of some 4mm 3ply, which I purchased at a car boot sale locally, while attending as a helper to raise funds for a local charity

A chap came along with sets of five, 5x2ft pieces taped together and being offered at

[gtmspyder]

More work done on the baseboards today.  The dowels and clips have arrived from an Ebay supplier and have been fitted, the master baseboard has had it's legs made and fitted from 2x1", with screwed and glued butt joints, and triangular gussets glued and screwed at each butt joint.  the head of the Glen end legs, to the right, are hinged to the base board, the 2x1" legs at the centre joint are mortised into and removable completely from, the base board.



The front profile facia and rear facia have been made from the 3mm 3ply, and the road from Lochearnhead up the Glen has been fitted along the front of the layout, again using the 3mm ply.  

Still to do is the actual railway track bed, which will be cantilevered off of the rear facia board for most of it's journey up the Glen except for the viaduct section, which, because of the bend, will turn away from the rear facia board to give a clear space between the viaduct and the rear facia.




The underside of the road is supported on small triangular brackets, cantilevered from the front facia ply wood at 9" intervals, and further strengthened by hot melt gluing along the edge of the road adjacent to the front facia.



The profile boards at the ends of the baseboards have still to be cut to the appropriate shape of the Glen, I will have a better idea of the shape when the track bed is in place.  I may have further valley profiles to cut for the intermediate space between the end profile boards depending upon how I construct the valley of the Glen.  I can't make my mind up whether to go for 25mm dense foam/polystyrene, ( I cant' think of the name of the stuff at the moment.)  cut into strips and butt jointed along the length of the Glen, which will not require intermediate profile boards, or the 3mm plywood cut into strips and laid lengthways along the Glen, which would need the additional profile boards as support?

Regards,

BrianT.

[gtmspyder]

Hello again, sorry for the length of time between posts, but I have problem that entails a new hip replacement in the very near future I hope.

I have had to have four days in hospital when my hip joint lining collapsed and left me in excruciating pain as the ball and socket rubbed bone on bone.  I have now seen the orthopods and I am now on the official official waiting list for the op. and the medication is helping to alleviate  some of the pain.

Today, I have managed to Zimmer frame my way into the garage and do a little work on the layout, I was fed up sitting in the armchair in pain, so I decided to do a little work where I could, and suffer the pain stood up rather than sat down.

So, here is a little progress:-

I was given an 8ft x 2ft x2ins piece of the high quality blue foam board from a building site, this was a little site damaged, but for my use, it is fine.  I intend to use this to form the contours of the Glen from the Loch Earn Head bottom of the Glen, to the glen Ogle head, with it's junction transfer station on the way to Crianlaric.

I cut the piece into two, 4ft x 2ft sections, then, each piece lengthways into four sections to suit the different contours of the glen sides.

the idea was that because of the inherent strength of the foam board, it would need little support across it's width when each section was in place and glued to each other.  Well, that's the theory anyway.

I fitted the four pieces of foam, temporarily in place on the first of the baseboards, and marked their positions, and then added support pieces to the board framework to support the ends of the foam board.



You can see the steepest foam support piece, diagonally at the top right of the picture,  you will also see chalk line rising, left to right on the back board, this indicates the track base level as it rises up the Glen side.  This will have to be transferred to the face of the foam, and the foam will be cut to form a shelf for the track bed, just as it was in the original construction of the line.

The lengths of foam were then replaced, the first or key central piece was held in place with two bamboo skewers put in place through the end profile board, where a support piece could not be fitted because the foam thickness reaches the bottom of the base board, the skewers were pushed into the end grain of the of the foam where it abutted the end profile piece at that end.



Because of the gradient from left to right as the Glen rises, the opposite end of that piece of foam could have a support piece fitted, as could the other three pieces.

Finally, the rest of the pieces were put into place, the two abutting the road were glued to each other with white PVA, the acute angled piece at the back which will carry the track bed, was just laid on the support pieces, so that I can remove it for working on the track bed later.



The middle profile board can now be marked out to the foam, then the two baseboards can be split and the first board contoured to the marked line with a jigsaw, the two boards fastened back together, and the cut profile transferred to the second board and cut, ready for laying the blue foam in place in a similar manner to the first

And finally for now, any largish gaps between adjacent pieces of foam, had Paper Mache kitchen towel caulked between them, and white PVA run into the gap.  On my next visit to the garage, I will turn the base board over and Paper Mache across the joints to add further strength to them, and when the track bed has been sculpted out of the back piece of foam, I will Paper Mache over the final joint and also the thinned foam board which will be quite thin where the horizontal in cut, meets the vertical in cut to form the track bed support timber.

Regards,

BrianT.

[gtmspyder]

Well here we go again, slowly, very slowly, the baseboards for Glen Ogle are being progressed, I managed an hour or so yesterday before I had to give up.
I started on the second baseboard, which will be the top of the Glen, and as I laid the blue foam, I got to be thinking more and more about what is going to happen to the track when the head of the Glen is reached.

As I have said before, the layout was inspired by the Cliffhanger Layout of Pilotfriend.

Now that basically, is an oval along a cliff, but has got some other interest with a station, the funicular and the Lido to interest, amuse and inspire the viewing  public, as well as the magnificent depiction of the scenery.

Compare this to my attempt at Glen Ogle, this has a beautifully scenic Glen, which has the A85 road running up one side, a railway running on a ledge at the other side, with a 20 arch viaduct crossing a section of the Glen where the hill side sets back a while before returning to a position where it is able to carry the line as the line reaches the summit of the Glen.

At this point, the railway and the road come together, and during it

[petersmith1942]

When does a prototype model become a freelance adventure? I tend to think models developed primarily to please others tend to fall short and even more so if they challenge (deliberately or otherwise) an earlier modelling effort. This is particularly the case with an outstanding effort like Cliffhanger. In my opinion you should as far as possible follow your prototype unless you start with a clear idea of how you wish to modify it to meet your modelling aims in the space you have available
Trying to change or develop the theme to give operator interest seems to me a bit like closing the stable door.........
If you stick to the prototype have you got outstanding prototype stock sufficient to hold viewers attention as it traverses the scene? If not you are not modelling the prototype anyway
I am just reading a magazine featuring a magnificent layout faithfully representing a true location. The turntable has been extended to accept prototypical locos that were never turned at this location because of the turntable. I find that odd but I only know the change because the author said so
The original Glen Ogle as described has enough to make me want to see its debut but a 9 inch radius curve at one end, unless carefully disguised, would not appeal to me. BUT as I am often told, it is your layout, do what pleases you
Hope that makes some sort of sense
Peter Smith

[Graeme Dunbar]

Tunnel entrances are perhaps the most common ploy to make track disappear off scene but there are others:

Road bridge - possibly less plausible given the location.

Dense Forestry Commission conifer plantation - a blight on the location, but quite plausible.

A snow tunnel (?? I'm  not sure of the terminology) I believe there is something like this on Rannoch Moor

A similar thing but a covering to protect from falling rocks (I've no idea of the correct name) as found on alpine routes - possibly a likely development given the real line was closed due to a land slip. However I don't think these have sides, just a roof.

It might even be possible to suggest the the railway continues on its straight path rather than take a sharp turn. On the other hand there is no reason why the NG line should follow the exact path of the standard gauge predecessor and there may then indeed be a much sharper curve than there was on the original track bed. To be convincing it might be best if the terrain makes it look as if this is a possibility which means that there probably wouldn't be major engineering works involved.

[gtmspyder]

Well now Peter, that's quite an observation, I asked for peoples thoughts, and take on board your observations, which I am sure were given in the spirit of helping.

No offence is taken from your observations, let's establish that from the start, and I will try and explain the mind-set that started me on this path.

I wanted to build a new layout, and had followed the build of Cliffhanger with interest, and saw it in the flesh at the Doncaster show.

During the Spring of this year, I made one of many in the past visits to Scotland, staying on this occasion at St Fillans, not to far from the site of my model.  I new the A85 road up Glen Ogle from Past visits, and have all ways thought the viaduct on the hillside very scenic, and thought what a great scenic model it would make, and this holidays drive past the scene, and the thoughts of the model Cliffhanger in mind, decided me to have a go at modelling this as a simple diorama, and so the die was cast, impetuosity took over, and base board build was underway.

As the build progressed, it slowly dawned that, apart from the scenery, there was not a lot of any operational potential, and thoughts were directed towards improving this.

The original diorama concept was thought to be a train traversing the rising grade of the Glen, and turning out of sight and returning back to the bottom, down the back of the scenic section to either another return bend, or a fiddle yard, in other words a roundy roundy layout that just happens to pass through a beautiful scene.
I thought that because I need to have small radius curves to restrict the overall size of the layout, I would imagineer  a group of wealthy people coming together to improve the tourist attractions of an area, by opening up a redundant railway line, and making it narrow gauge to reduce build costs .
So, having seen the Isle of Stoner layout, with it

[garrywhiting]

A snow tunnel (?? I'm  not sure of the terminology) I believe there is something like this on Rannoch Moor

A similar thing but a covering to protect from falling rocks (I've no idea of the correct name) as found on alpine routes - possibly a likely development given the real line was closed due to a land slip. However I don't think these have sides, just a roof.

/quote]

Graeme,  They are called "Snow Sheds " -- try Google Search for examples

Garry

[Graeme Dunbar]

A snow tunnel (?? I'm  not sure of the terminology) I believe there is something like this on Rannoch Moor

A similar thing but a covering to protect from falling rocks (I've no idea of the correct name) as found on alpine routes - possibly a likely development given the real line was closed due to a land slip. However I don't think these have sides, just a roof.

Graeme,  They are called "Snow Sheds " -- try Google Search for examples

Garry

Thanks Gary. That's the one. It had been a long day and it was getting late!

I should have remembered. I know Alan Mitchell who modelled it, see here:
http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/1970-rannoch-moor/page-19



I was going to add that placing a point at the hidden curve would allow the track continue to the end of the baseboard to allow for future expansion.

[WALLSHIRTS]

You could always add on to the layout at a later date if you feel it lacks operational interest. What you're doing seems fine. I'm looking forward to your completion of this project. Should be quite an eye catching exhibition layout.
Mal.

[gtmspyder]

Thank you Graham and Mal for your contributions.

I am finding it quite frustrating not being able to progress as fast as I would like because of my duff hip, but the ideas are being taken on board and I do appreciate all your input.

BrianT.

[Graeme Dunbar]

You could always add on to the layout at a later date if you feel it lacks operational interest. What you're doing seems fine. I'm looking forward to your completion of this project. Should be quite an eye catching exhibition layout.
Mal.

That was my thoughts too. The layout as it stands is very elegant. If anything then perhaps a passing loop on the assumption that this scene is half way along the line. That would add some interest, changes in movement and an excuse to halt trains.

[gtmspyder]

I think the local populace of Lochearnhead and Killin had enough trouble with the Caledonian railway in the past with the siting of there original stations without me pretend engineering a station halfway up a mountainside. ;D ;D ;D

It would look nice though to have a passing loop wouldn't it?

I wonder if a passing loop has ever been constructed on a viaduct? ::)  After all, this is going to be narrow gauge built on a standard gauge structure, and the viaduct is the star centrepiece of the layout. :)

Observations anyone?

Kind regards,

BrianT.

[Graeme Dunbar]

Perhaps not a station, but a halt added when the line was reopened as NG is a possibility. It depends on the back story.  Is there scenic vantage point nearby for  tourists to trek to? A halt need only be a few loads of quarry dust leveled out to keep the weeds at bay. No need for a platform. A really posh one might have the equivalent of a bus shelter.

A simple shelter (and ticket machine) is all there is at the nearest station to home (Dyce) - and that is a busy commuter station and station for Aberdeen airport. Many NG layouts do seem to be very well provided with facilities. (Mind you they quite possibly run services that would put London Underground to shame!)

[gtmspyder]

Been feeling a little better today, so an hour or two in the garage has seen a little progress.



All the blue foam has now been laid on the base boards and fastened down except for the near vertical back sections where the railway line will be.  These have been marked with a chalk line where the track shelf will run.



To help strengthen these two pieces that will support the railway track, I have pasted on the back a heavy duty lining paper, which will strengthen the foam where a triangular section  will be cut away to form the track bed on the Glen side.  When this triangular section is cut out, only a thin section of the foam will be left, so I hope the heavy duty paper will, like Paper Mache add strength without weight.



I could not resist trying a sample cut on the left board section, I cut in along the line drawn on the foam as near to horizontal as I could estimate, then cut down into the foam trying to keep the cut as vertical as possible till the two cuts met. Then I was able to prise out the cut section.  I did not cut into the horizontal cut as far as I will need to eventually, as the strengthening paper was still wet and weak.  The Multi-Master tool you see in the picture is a multi purpose oscillating cutter with many interchangeable blades, that look like circular saw blades in some instances, but do not rotate, but oscillates at many hundreds of oscillations a minute. The oscillation movements are so short, that you can hold the moving blade gripped in your hand and it does not cut you, because the flesh is not moved far enough during each oscillation so does not open up the skin, this is the kind of tool that will have frightened many people with a pot on there arm when they go into a plaster room at a hospital to have the plaster cast removed. You might just see to the right of the removed section that the horizontal track line has been cut a bit further to the right, then peters out to just a pencil line, this is where the start of the viaduct which with leave the back as it crosses the depression in the Glen side which I have created by angling the two baseboard sections away from the straight, this will eb bridged by the new Viaduct I have yet to make.



A self explanatory picture showing what the eventual cut will be like.



I have placed my first abortive attempt at a viaduct in position just to show the approximate location of the new one when built.

Well, that's about it for today, progress is being made, albeit very slowly.

Regards,

BrianT.