Peco / Kato Small England Locos

[JulienW]

One of the main 'selling points' of DCC is the ability to run multiple locos on the same bit of track.

Given the vast majority of narrow gauge railways run a 'one loco in steam' policy I'm at a loss to see why that would make DCC a necessity for an 009 loco.

Yes, some aspects of DCC - sound for example - are nice to have but I suspect that for a large proportion of 009 modellers "DCC or not" isn't going to be a deal breaker for these locos, especially given how easy it is to wire a chip in to a chassis not designed for one.

Coming back to the subject of this thread - the Peco / Kato Small England Locos for those who have forgotten - let us not forget that KATO are a Japanese company who are primarily aiming at their own domestic market. My feeling is that given the small size of much Japanese accommodation the layouts these locos will be destined for will be small, one loco in steam operations rather (like the majority of home based Japanese layouts?) than the narrow gauge empires sometimes found in the UK, and quite a number are probably going to end up static in display cases. This being the case why on earth would KATO go to the effort and expense of fitting onboard DCC jiggery pokery that most of their target audience will not need, nor want to pay a premium for.

All Peco are doing is offering some technical expertise. As far as I am aware they do not have any financial stake in the project other than lining themselves up to be the main (soul?) UK distributor, and to be honest I suspect that their assessment of DCC and 009 is not too dissimilar to mine.

Should anyone feel strongly that this should not be the case I suggest that they express their views directly to KATO- don't forget that Mr Hiroshi Kato is (or at least was) a member of our Society so I'm sure could be contacted via our Membership Secretary  - rather than complaining on a forum Mr Kato may not be a member of.

[Pete Williams]

VERY dissapointed with this announcement- i'm sure i read that this loco was going to be DCC compatable.
At my age and with my eyesight,i'm certainly not risking buying  and then doing irrepairable damage by trying  to fit a chip so-sorry, no sale, I'll save my cash and buy a bachmann 'Britomart' when they are available.  :'(

[Pete Williams]

One of the main 'selling points' of DCC is the ability to run multiple locos on the same bit of track.

Given the vast majority of narrow gauge railways run a 'one loco in steam' policy I'm at a loss to see why that would make DCC a necessity for an 009 loco.

Yes, some aspects of DCC - sound for example - are nice to have but I suspect that for a large proportion of 009 modellers "DCC or not" isn't going to be a deal breaker for these locos, especially given how easy it is to wire a chip in to a chassis not designed for one.

Coming back to the subject of this thread - the Peco / Kato Small England Locos for those who have forgotten - let us not forget that KATO are a Japanese company who are primarily aiming at their own domestic market. My feeling is that given the small size of much Japanese accommodation the layouts these locos will be destined for will be small, one loco in steam operations rather (like the majority of home based Japanese layouts?) than the narrow gauge empires sometimes found in the UK, and quite a number are probably going to end up static in display cases. This being the case why on earth would KATO go to the effort and expense of fitting onboard DCC jiggery pokery that most of their target audience will not need, nor want to pay a premium for.

All Peco are doing is offering some technical expertise. As far as I am aware they do not have any financial stake in the project other than lining themselves up to be the main (soul?) UK distributor, and to be honest I suspect that their assessment of DCC and 009 is not too dissimilar to mine.

Should anyone feel strongly that this should not be the case I suggest that they express their views directly to KATO- don't forget that Mr Hiroshi Kato is (or at least was) a member of our Society so I'm sure could be contacted via our Membership Secretary  - rather than complaining on a forum Mr Kato may not be a member of.

yes- but not really helpful if your layout is already fully DCC!

[JulienW]

VERY dissapointed with this announcement- i'm sure i read that this loco was going to be DCC compatable.
At my age and with my eyesight,i'm certainly not risking buying  and then doing irrepairable damage by trying  to fit a chip so-sorry, no sale, I'll save my cash and buy a bachmann 'Britomart' when they are available.  :'(

I now that some DCC systems allow one to run a single analogue loco as 'Loco 0' (my digitrax system does). It may not be all that beneficial to the motor though.

Equally I'm sure there will be someone out there who would be willing to hard wire the chip in for you (try your local 009 Society area group?) even if a modest fee was involved...

[JulienW]

still wouldn't do it with any system

I'm dubious about it too.

My large 2-8-0 Victoria with a large 5 pole skew-wound open frame motor made a noise like the turbo generator running at full chat - I assume as the armature vibrated slightly with the AC current. Who needs a sound chip!

The small can motor Dapol 2-6-2 chassis run in a similar way expired when the magic smoke was released... :'(

[Stephen Rainsbury]

One of the main 'selling points' of DCC is the ability to run multiple locos on the same bit of track.

Given the vast majority of narrow gauge railways run a 'one loco in steam' policy I'm at a loss to see why that would make DCC a necessity for an 009 loco.

Have experimented with DCC I came to the conclusion that I prefer the way that locos respond to a controller when wired for DCC, especially really old ones.  Whether it is worth the expense is a different argument that I am still having with myself.

My feeling is that given the small size of much Japanese accommodation the layouts these locos will be destined for will be small, one loco in steam operations rather (like the majority of home based Japanese layouts?)

I agree but it still surprises me that DCC has not taken off in a society that I normally associate with high tech gadgets. I would have assumed that they would love the idea of controlling everything from a tablet or phone.

[Graeme Dunbar]

My feeling is that given the small size of much Japanese accommodation the layouts these locos will be destined for will be small, one loco in steam operations rather (like the majority of home based Japanese layouts?)

I agree but it still surprises me that DCC has not taken off in a society that I normally associate with high tech gadgets. I would have assumed that they would love the idea of controlling everything from a tablet or phone.

The other side is the national stereotype of being very traditionalist. One video that sticks in my mind is of a modeller taking a 'layout' out of a carefully crafted wooden case, assembling it from individual pieces of track and lineside accessories, running some trains and putting it away again. It had all the hallmarks (to my Western eyes) of a tea ceremony. Every piece of track, scenery and stock had its purpose-designed box or slot in the case.

Also they seem keen on controllers that mimic certain prototype equipment.


Playing up the national stereotype shamelessly, it would not seem out of place if it came with a pair of white gloves.  :)

A ZTX DCC command station had a similar vibe, but I think it is a very specialist interest.

[JulienW]

Have experimented with DCC I came to the conclusion that I prefer the way that locos respond to a controller when wired for DCC, especially really old ones.  Whether it is worth the expense is a different argument that I am still having with myself.

I did say "a necessity" in my post. I can see advantages using DCC (sound for one thing) and then there is also the personal preference of the individual...

...but it still surprises me that DCC has not taken off in a society that I normally associate with high tech gadgets. I would have assumed that they would love the idea of controlling everything from a tablet or phone.

I must say that's a somewhat different association than I have, but then having had rapidly approaching 40 years continuous membership things have changed in the last few years.

As this is a thread about the Peco/KATO Small England locos perhaps further discussion about the pros and cons of DCC, or the traditionalism or not of railway modellers should be continued in different threads?

[Paulc]

There seem to be some issues with some of these.  Got mine the other day, the cab was loose, no great problem.  I put it on a test track and it was reluctant to move  but when it did the crank pin fell out.  I found it and put it back but still very poor running which seemed to be related to the tender.  Not wishing to fiddle too much more I rang Peco.

They were very helpful, as always. It seems some have been dropped resulting in loose cab, crank pins and chimneys (Yes mine was loose as well) although they had not heard of any running issues.

They are going to take it back at their expense (I didn't buy it from them but all the retailer could offer was them returning it to Peco).

If anyone has one do check the crank pins are properly pushed in; if it pops out it may be difficult to find!

IMO it is a very nice model, I'm guessing the drop has done something to the tender pick up which is a shame.

[Paulc]

Thought I should update the above.  Loco returned by Peco in a few days with no charge, everything fixed and now runs very well.  Excellent service from Peco.