Rabbit Warren for the Young and Old!

[tedp]

The forwarding system Graeme mentions, using coloured tokens, is described here:

http://www.009dutch.nl/cdr/main/pages/eoperation1.htm

More on layout operation is here: http://www.009dutch.nl/cdr/main/pages/eoperation.htm

The token system can be used even on a small layout. For extra interest, think of a kickback siding at the cider mill - it will add a shunting puzzle!

[Roy Parkes]

Not bad at all, Roy. Plenty of operating scope, and I like that fiddle yard idea.

Having said that, the sidings can have a slight curve - they tend to follow the main line as railway land usually was narrow. It makes for a more natural flow and you'll have more siding length. Not too tight a curve as you need to couple up rolling stock.

I wouldn't change it otherwise.

Ted, thanks for the positive comments and will do as you suggest.

[Roy Parkes]

The fiddle yard is a good idea. I see the potential for using it as is with storage for two trains, as a staging area (add and remove trains) or attaching cassettes if when your stock increases.

Also in terms of 'playability' the back-to-back halves mean two people (young or old) can dispatch trains to one another, potentially with a third 'supervisor' on duty looking after the fiddle yard.

If not a full backscene between the two halves, you could have a scenic break between them so the track on the other side is partly or wholly obscured. If you have two operators facing each other they would be able to see each other but not fully what is happening at track level. That might add to the interest for young operators. It could be buildings, hill, cliff, retaining wall, trees etc. etc. I see 'road bridge' indicated: if it was moved to the bottom near the join (or even over it if it was removable) it would make and effective scenic break.

If the 'players' are up to some shunting, I might consider adding another siding to the 'Cidermill' side. It would give the opportunity to (presumably) drop off empties or raw materials and pick up the finished product.

Ted P. has described a system of coloured tokens here or non NGRM-online that are placed in or on goods wagons to represent various goods.

On the other hand of course you may be visualising the two halves as one scene with 'Cidermill' as part of the station complex and the rest of the world behind the backscene.

Thanks for the helpful comments Graeme, it is not my intention to have a full scenic break between the boards, thinking more along the lines of a raised scenic area as a break between the Cider Mill and the Station.
And where you suggest a road bridge I was going to perhaps try a footbridge and footpath.

[Roy Parkes]

I will try and put all this together over the next few days and come up with something a bit nearer a final plan!!

Perhaps I will start a new topic as this is no longer a Rabbit Warren.

Hopefully I hope to go to the SWOONS members open day next Saturday and no doubt came away with a few goodies and ideas.

Roy.

[B.Meldon]

Taken on board all advice given and have come up with the following simple plan for my small layout.

Radius are 12" or 10" and all points are 12".

Its all very rough at the moment, details to sort.



Any thoughts please.

Firstly Roy it is far more difficult to successfully propel (push) 009 trains that it is to just pull them.
Propelling trains into sidings around 10 inch curves will show up any inconsistences in the track or couplings, far more than when just pulling them around the same curves. To get this to work successfully will require everything to be adjusted spot on and the track laid perfectly without any kinks dips or steps. But provided you are willing to do this it should work fine.

Curving the sidings has been mentioned, this can indeed improve the appearance of the layout, however 009 couplings do not couple up automatically on curves. So any siding or loop where you wish to couple items together will need to be straight, or nearly so. Some experimentation with the locos and stock you will be using will be needed to establish just how straight these sections will have to be to enable automatic coupling up.
On one layout (Pitztalbahn) we had to lift and re-lay a siding straight that was originally curved as we found at the first exhibition that nothing would couple together without manual intervention, making the siding useless!
But obviously if you intend to keep the trains in fixed sets with the loco attached all the time curved sidings and loops will not be a problem.

You show a platform on a curve on the plan. You will need to measure how low the overhangs on the locos and rolling stock you will be using will be to ensure this platform is not too high and that nothing hits it. On many real narrow gauge railways the platforms are at, or very near rail height with steps on the coaches and locos.

Another little tip that may well help a lot later when you start to use the layout is to ensure that all the sidings and the clearance in the loop is designed for the same length of train. There is no point having one siding longer if the trains are all going to have to be shorter. (Knowing the length of your trains in advance helps as well as without this you could well build the loops just a little too short for an extra wagon or coach to fit in.)

Obviously these are just my thoughts and they are not set in stone, you can go your own way with all the above.

Brian Meldon

[Roy Parkes]

Got me worried now Brian regarding the shunting, would you suggest that I keep the sidings straight?

I hope to perhaps tweek things a bit so that I can indeed only use 12 " rad curves and Peco 12"[Sl-E492 and SL-E491] points, will see.

Also thinking of using the standard Peco coupling as fitted to their ready to run wagons, but remove the hook from one end, this is what I did on my previous 7mmNG layout, this should help.

Roy

[tedp]

Sorry Brian - give Roy a break, you're scaring him to death! If his layout is built just with straight sidings and straight loops it will never fit on that baseboard. There are plenty layouts with curved loops and sidings around that work perfectly.

Roy - compromise is the mother of invention. 009 couplings will couple on curves provided they are not too tight (i.e. not on an 8"curve). It's a small layout and if the couplings won't hook up first go, they can be reached easily. It depends on the stock involved how far you can go. Experiment a little and you will find what you can get away with.

On Nixnie I propel 009 stock through 8" curves all the time, without mishap. Make sure the track joints are neat, and if you don't trust yourself to lay flextrack, then use set track curves. Test the layout without committing yourself to anything, before ballasting etc., and see what needs to be improved.

None of my layouts worked right first try.   ;)

[B.Meldon]

Ted is correct in regards to curves sidings and loops it will all depend on the locos and stock you are going to use, how long the individual coupling over hang is on each vehicle and how wide the coupling loop is. Some items like the Roco/Minitrains small four wheel wagons for example will couple up on a curve where as other items with a longer coupling overhang will not. But the only way to be sure is to test what you have.


I have not got any of the RTR Peco wagons or coaches so I cannot tell you what issues there may be with the plastic coupling loops on these.
However all my rolling stock has the coupling loops on both ends and the locos have no coupling loops at all. This is because I want to have the choice of what way around I put them on the track. Provided all the coupling loops are exactly horizontal in both directions they work just fine and they hardly ever both lift together.


Brian Meldon

[Roy Parkes]

Thanks both - Phew.

Roy.

[gallopingalice]

As MinitrainS are designed to traverse 9

[tedp]

Here is a video of my Brigadelok on an 8" curve. No problem.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx4Ty5UYAxw

[Roy Parkes]

Thanks Ted for the reassuring video, will now crack on and see how I get on, non of my curves are 8" trying to keep to min of 10".

Roy.

[gallopingalice]

Much to my astonishment, the brigadeloc will pull/push 22 bogie wagons around a 9

[tedp]

 ;D  I told you so!