Open letter about the forum

[wimorrison]

Alan,

I think that your reply to my mail and the comments of others in the testing section is particularly harsh, and could be seen as inconsiderate.

I was making genuine and valid suggestions for the improvement of the forum and despite the post being in the 'Testing' which we, mere members, are not meant to use it  still received positive replies supporting the suggestions.

If you recall the old forum that we used to use on Yahoo! groups there were many subjects of a non specific nature that were greatly enjoyed by many members of that forum who are now members of this forum - I dare to suggest that we would enjoy some very robust and interesting conversations if the facility was provided.

Rather than making the arbitrary decision that you have why not offer the members a chance to use and excellent facility to the maximum extent.

I have deliberately placed this here as it is something that is valid for all members to discuss and it does not fit under any of the headings that you have chosen to create. I also invite other members to comment in open forum (which this is meant to be) rather than in private mails.

I request that you reconsider your reply and accede to the request for a general discussion forum.

Iain Morrison

[Cambridge Paul]

When I was just starting work I was given some sage advice by my boss:
"Never send a letter to anyone that would cause you embarrassment if read out by a judge";
"Never say anything about anyone that you would not be prepared to tell them to their face"; and
"Always return a hurt with a good turn

[alan]

Alan,

I think that your reply to my mail and the comments of others in the testing section is particularly harsh, and could be seen as inconsiderate.

I was making genuine and valid suggestions for the improvement of the forum and despite the post being in the 'Testing' which we, mere members, are not meant to use it  still received positive replies supporting the suggestions.

If you recall the old forum that we used to use on Yahoo! groups there were many subjects of a non specific nature that were greatly enjoyed by many members of that forum who are now members of this forum - I dare to suggest that we would enjoy some very robust and interesting conversations if the facility was provided.

Rather than making the arbitrary decision that you have why not offer the members a chance to use and excellent facility to the maximum extent.

I have deliberately placed this here as it is something that is valid for all members to discuss and it does not fit under any of the headings that you have chosen to create. I also invite other members to comment in open forum (which this is meant to be) rather than in private mails.

I request that you reconsider your reply and accede to the request for a general discussion forum.

Iain Morrison

Sorry! I missed this when posted.. my apologies for the delay in replying. Can I please re-iterate that to achieve the maximum possible audience that such comments are addressed to the Secretary so that they can be addressed in Committee and brought to the attention of all Society members through the 009 News. I'll pass this on to the Committee in this instance.

I apologise also if you took offence at my comments; they were not intentionally written to antagonise and I am sorry if I wrote them in such a way that gave this impression.

Alan

[JulienW]

<snip>

If you recall the old forum that we used to use on Yahoo! groups there were many subjects of a non specific nature that were greatly enjoyed by many members of that forum who are now members of this forum - I dare to suggest that we would enjoy some very robust and interesting conversations if the facility was provided.

<snip>

Iain Morrison

As moderator of "the old forum that we used to use on Yahoo! groups" it was the "subjects of a non-specific nature" that caused me the most problems and sleepless nights. Furthermore, the "robust conversation" so easily turned into flaming on the group, and even harrasment via e-mail off the group in some cases.  Not something I enjoyed to be on the receiving end of or to find out about second hand.

Also, the "non specific"  traffic on the Yahoo group had the potential to cause the Society the most damage, and ultimately lead to the Society severing its official ties to the group on Yahoo!  This is why the header on this forum reminds members to "Please use it wisely".  It also lead to my applying a new set of rules to the Yahoo! group (much like those on this forum), as opposed to guidelines for posting, so that as moderator I could better deal with such problems in the future.

I would respectfully suggest that if members which to discuss areas outside of 009 modell railways there are probably other better forums (fora?) for such discussions, and that I understand that it is not too dificult to set up such a forum for oneself if a suitable forum for subjects of a non-specific nature does not exist.

[wimorrison]

Julien,

I have to bow to your greater knowledge of the old forum and as moderator you must have seen many things which as a user of the group I did not - I do not, and will never, support any abuse of people or their views and agree that such outbursts must be nipped in the bud.

When I placed my original request for a general discussion group I did not expect that it would generate such strong responses - I was asking for an area for discussion on non-specific subjects meaning non-specific to the forum sections that are listed. I cannot imagine why someone would want to discuss anything other than model railways on a model railway forum, especially a closed group such as this.

I suggest that the current use of the General - Anything to do with Prototype section is exactly what I was suggesting. None of the topics discussed there fit into the specified topics and they meet the criteria of 'non-specific' that I was requesting

Dare I suggest that the simple removal of the term Anything to do with Prototype or replacement with e.g. Anything to do with Prototype will actually fit the bill?

Hopefully this will be seen as constructive, something I have been trying to be all along  :)

Iain

[Graeme Dunbar]

Iain,

I agree with your sentiments, but we have been informed in the past we should to contact the Committee directly regarding such matters. It is clear to me that there is a need or at least a desire for a general area as you suggest (or something equivalent) as indicated by by recent postings on a Kent Area Group and my post a little earlier on members going to Modelrail Scotland. They do not fit into any of the categories provided to us but I believe they are legitimate and reasonable use of electronic communication between members of the Society. May I suggest that anyone here who has an interest in seeing the forum progress contact the Committee? I will be doing so.

[JulienW]

Before contacting the Committee it would be best to decide exactly what you are asking for.

As has been shown by previous posts in this thread simply asking for a "general" or "non-specific" area on this group will probably be met with a negative response - not because the Committee are against the idea of this forum (or any ideas presented by the membership) but because a forum where members could discuss anything (and everything) - whether it related to 009 model railways or not - has the potential to cause huge damage to the Society which would be deemed to have published such comments (not necessarily the member posting it).

As far as I am concerned, postings about "is anyone going to a certain show" or "Anyone living on Rockall? - how about forming a group" on this forum are fine (they would be removed if not!), and "Prototype - General" is as good a place as any.

BUT

Surely such things, essentially the opportunity to meet other Society members or the formation of local groups, would be of benefit to 100% of this Society's 1100 or so members rather than the 133 (around 10%) who are members of this forum?

Would it not be better to put these in letters to 009 News (e-mailed to the Editor) so that those who for whatever reason are not members of this forum can participate in such things rather than making the majority of our members feel that in addition to paying their annual subs they have to be equipped with a home PC and internet connection or trek to their (maybe not so) local library to fully participate in the Society's activities.

Perhaps the issue is not "legitimate and reasonable use of electronic communication between members of the Society" but rather the use of a form of communication which, for whatever reason, excludes 80 to 90% of the Society's members from participating in the discussion.

Personally I find that sitting here typing this eats into my modelling time ::)

And there are enough weirdoes at my local library without my joining them! :o

[wimorrison]

Julien,

I thought that the membership of the forum was larger than you suggest, at such a small penetration I understand the point that you make about about not reaching the majority of the membership. I do not think that this forum could ever reach 100% of the membership, it is after all their choice whether to use this or not, whether they have access at home, in the office or even at the local library as you intimate is your preferred choice. I also suspect that there are many society members who could have access to the forum, but for whatever reason chose not to take up this option, therefore the 10% is only reflective of those who want to use the facility and not of those who have the ability to use the forum.

I would point out though that if we used the magazine for all discussions then even this one would have taken 8 months to reach this point as the fastest responses would still be limited to the distribution of the magazine  :)

Perhaps the question is how do we promote the use of the forum to a greater percentage of the membership?

Regarding the weirdos at the local library, my family think that it is me who is the weirdo as I want to 'play with model train thingumies' and that the people in the library are normal  :-\