Hi All,
I recently bought a train-set with Steatite with 3 open toast-rack coaches, It was new and wrapped in sealed cellophane.
When I tried to run the Loco, the motor was turning, but, sadly no movement. Today I found out how to separate the body from the chassis, and found the plastic gear was loose inside in 2 parts, broken across the motor shaft mounting hole.
I don't think that glueing it would work, so I think I need a replacement gear. I cannot find anywhere on Google, but wondered if your knowledge could help with finding a replacement. I didn't feel I could return it to the seller, as he was an innocent party, like me.
David Banks
That is unfortunate. I have not seen that before on these locos and I have owned quite a few.
A repair with super glue may be possible. However, you will have to drill out the hole in the middle slightly so that the motor shaft does not expand the plastic gear, but it is still a smooth fit on to the shaft. Once the two halves have been glued together you can then slip it onto the motor shaft and super glue it in place.
There is a gear supplier in Poland that will be able to help, but it will not be cheep for just one gear.
You could try the 009 Sales team to see if they have any spares?
B Meldon, Many thanks for your input. I thought of loctite, but I was worried it might not stand the torsional movement. I suppose that I've nothing to lose in trying it, but I will see if the Sales Team can help as well.
I don't have much luck with buying new on Ebay. A while back I bought a Minitrains Decauville which was advertised as new, but when I ran it the light wasn't working, and I'm not sure how to fix that either. I bought it from a lady who was selling her deceased Father's Railway items, and she thought it was new. It does look and run as new though.
Have a look at this thread, some people thee have replaced the motor and drive with a coreless motor and drive belt from Nigel Lawton, one of them may be able to help.
https://www.009society.com/forum/index.php?topic=4311.msg30423#msg30423
Many thanks Stephen, I have used the Nigel Lawton drive belt system before, on a Beyer Peacock chassis, but never thought of changing the primary drive.
David, it may also be worth checking the spur gears on the axles too, as these are known to split and it would be a shame to go to all the effort of replacing / reworking the first stage only to find that the second stage is also banjaxed as they probably use the same plastic and they will be the same age as the first stage gearing.
From memory I think that the worm and wheel sets that Nigel Lawton sells will fit as a replacement, but I've not done this myself so it may well be worth checking.
Quote from: David Banks on March 23, 2021, 20:05
... but I will see if the Sales Team can help as well.
Try Alan Hamer at : spares@009society.com
David.
If it is the worm gear on the motor shaft that is split then it should be relatively easy to replace. Motor shafts are usually 1mm diameter or 1.5mm (use a drill bit of each size to check the size if you don't have measuring tools) the replacement worm just needs to have the correct size hole. Available worm gear suppliers have already been mentioned above. I agree with also checking the spur gears for splits also as these are notorious for breaking.
It may be a drastic solution but you could consider upgrading the motor to a modern coreless variety with a suitable worm gear. This type of motor should perform so much better than the original.
Quote from: Neverbetter on March 24, 2021, 09:42
If it is the worm gear on the motor shaft that is split then it should be relatively easy to replace. Motor shafts are usually 1mm diameter or 1.5mm (use a drill bit of each size to check the size if you don't have measuring tools) the replacement worm just needs to have the correct size hole. Available worm gear suppliers have already been mentioned above. I agree with also checking the spur gears for splits also as these are notorious for breaking.
It may be a drastic solution but you could consider upgrading the motor to a modern coreless variety with a suitable worm gear. This type of motor should perform so much better than the original.
This is a photo of the two versions of the chassis. The older version from 1966 to 1972 is above the far better 1980's version with the skew wound can motor is below. Both have the same grey plastic gear wheel that is broken on David's example. However the 1980's chassis has a thinner mototr shaft.
The only worms are on the lay shaft set undrer the motor in the chassis. they are the same size as those used in the 1960's minitrains Baldwin and Plymouth locos. However unlike the 1960's Minitrains locos they do not suffer with split gears anything like as much.
Ah, now I can see your problem. Picture paints a thousand words as they say. I assumed (wrongly) that it was a conventional worm on the motor shaft. I'd go for the drive belt / pulley solution previously mentioned so you avoid having to source that elusive gear wheel.
Quote from: Neverbetter on March 24, 2021, 20:20
Ah, now I can see your problem. Picture paints a thousand words as they say. I assumed (wrongly) that it was a conventional worm on the motor shaft. I'd go for the drive belt / pulley solution previously mentioned so you avoid having to source that elusive gear wheel.
I am looking to do that on a couple of these too, but plan to change the gear ratio so it doesn't go as fast and will hopefully operate better at slower speeds. I will probably change one of them for a small coreless motor and flywheel too, just to see if I can :-)
Quote from: Stephen Rainsbury on March 24, 2021, 22:55
I am looking to do that on a couple of these too, but plan to change the gear ratio so it doesn't go as fast and will hopefully operate better at slower speeds. I will probably change one of them for a small coreless motor and flywheel too, just to see if I can :-)
The worm and gear on the lay shaft/axle already give 15:1 gearing, there is also a little move in the two vertical gears as there are more teeth on the brass gear than the one on the motor shaft. In fact the 1980's version of the chassis with the skew wound can motor runs very well and with the right controller, a KPC full feedback for example, so does the older chassis.
The main issue with a drive belt system is that the belts tend to get 'set' if they are not used regularly. You may also find it hard to get a pully to fit the in the layshaft gear slot.
Brian Meldon
I agree that it is going to be an interesting job, but worth a go.
I now have 4 of these locos, one of which has very low electrical resistance, it only crawls along before tripping out my controller at 500mA. I am working on the principle that the coils are fried, so that is the one destined for the "resto-mod" as the car fraternity refer to it.
The body was warped beyond use too, which supports the theory that it got too hot, so I have a spare but that needs quite a bit of work first.
Quote from: Stephen Rainsbury on March 25, 2021, 12:25
I agree that it is going to be an interesting job, but worth a go.
I now have 4 of these locos, one of which has very low electrical resistance, it only crawls along before tripping out my controller at 500mA. I am working on the principle that the coils are fried, so that is the one destined for the "resto-mod" as the car fraternity refer to it.
The body was warped beyond use too, which supports the theory that it got too hot, so I have a spare but that needs quite a bit of work first.
Regarding the slow motor. All may not be lost!
I would guess it is not one of the 1980's locos with the can motor, but one of the 1960's/70's. versions. (See my post above for photos of both types.)
The first thing to do is to check the brushes, these may well be worn down. The brush springs may also have become weaker as the brushes became smaller and this causes them to heat up. The heat then weakens the spring ever more making the situation even worse! You can try stretching the brush springs so the brushes are pushed harder onto the motor, this may well help a lot.
As the motor is no good the way it is now you have nothing to lose by trying.
Next you may well find that the magnet has de-magnetized.
You can replace these with a stack of the small, rare earth disk magnets, again this can help a lot.
Keeping the original magnets out of the motor for a length of time does tend to speed up the demagnetisation.
Quote from: B.Meldon on March 25, 2021, 12:42
I would guess it is not one of the 1980's locos with the can motor, but one of the 1960's/70's. versions. (See my post above for photos of both types.)
Thanks Brian, all of mine are the early ones and none have a decent body so I will try to make one good one and the rest might end up under other models.
Quote from: B.Meldon on March 25, 2021, 12:42
The first thing to do is to check the brushes, these may well be worn down. The brush springs may also have become weaker as the brushes became smaller and this causes them to heat up. The heat then weakens the spring ever more making the situation even worse! You can try stretching the brush springs so the brushes are pushed harder onto the motor, this may well help a lot.
As the motor is no good the way it is now you have nothing to lose by trying.
You are right they are bad, I managed to pick up a pack of 5 brushes from an exhibition which are slightly smaller than the original, but seem to work quite well, unfortunately the trader didn't know what make they were or where they came from.
Quote from: B.Meldon on March 25, 2021, 12:42
Next you may well find that the magnet has de-magnetized.
You can replace these with a stack of the small, rare earth disk magnets, again this can help a lot.
Keeping the original magnets out of the motor for a length of time does tend to speed up the demagnetisation.
Yes it is not good. on one of my others I potted 5 small Neodymium magnets in milliput and filed that to be the same size as the original, that makes quite a difference, but noticeably increased the current so I remembered what have said in the past about over heating, and only run it for a few minutes. Once we have moved I plan to see if I can 3D print a replacement with a hold in the middle to hold a small stack.
Hi All,
Many thanks to you for your help and advice, it's much appreciated 👍. Sorry for my late response to all your help, but if I could fix my body as easily as Steatite, I would start playing Rugby again😂
I contacted Alan Hamer, and a few days later was in receipt of a new gear. I had to add a bit of .01mm shim formed around the motor shaft to give a nice fit with no wobble, and a wee bit of superglue. Steatite now runs like the new Loco she is.
David