Hi all
I'm planning another layout and considering topside point motors. My question is, is it possible to operate the electro frog polarity switch from this type of point motor?
I have always used the beneath board motors and switches in the past which work fine but it is rather tedious getting the point motor and the points lined up. Anything for an easier life!
Cheers
I've never heard of a brand called "topside", do you mean you are going to use a Peco or similar point motor and mount it on the surface of the baseboard, i.e. surface mounted point motor?
If so most point motors usually have a special fixing to mount the motor on the surface so you need to check the instructions, I'd be surprised if there isn't a polarity switch as well. Looking at the Peco set up you can still mount the polarity changing microswitch on top of the motor when using their surface mounted adaptor.
If it is surface mount point actuators such as this:
https://railsofsheffield.com/products/11134/peco-pl-11-any-scale-pl11-side-mounted-turnout-motor?gclid=Cj0KCQiAqo3-BRDoARIsAE5vnaKs3tYh7FNsxaa4pLUtvHx5A3UAYAlbQAxGBjAy3mGQ3wxWRD2EcOkaAqi8EALw_wcB (https://railsofsheffield.com/products/11134/peco-pl-11-any-scale-pl11-side-mounted-turnout-motor?gclid=Cj0KCQiAqo3-BRDoARIsAE5vnaKs3tYh7FNsxaa4pLUtvHx5A3UAYAlbQAxGBjAy3mGQ3wxWRD2EcOkaAqi8EALw_wcB)
There is a bit on it here:
https://www.modelrailforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=8131 (https://www.modelrailforum.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=8131)
Looking at the surface mounted 'slimline' Peco point motor (PL-11) shown in GraemeD's link I don't think that can be easily fitted with frog polarity switching, though not impossible given sufficient ingenuity (using microswitches actuated by the tie bar of the point?), but I have fitted Peco's 'standard' point motor with the extended pin with their accessory switch (PL-13) and Twin micro switch kit (PL-15) with the point motor surface mounted with the PL-12 adaptor on an N-scale layout built for my father-in-law. I can't now recall if the setup used both the PL-13 and PL-15 on the same motor, but as we used the changing of a point leading into a diamond crossing to control the polarity of both the point frog and the frogs on the crossing they well may have been stacked - though I may have doubled up on the wiring to the PL-15 and used that to do both sets of frogs.
If anything having the PL-15 and its point motor on top of the board made life easier as the switch needed a little adjustment and this was much easier to do compared to the one at the other end of the junction, which was under the baseboard and needed the point motor de-mounting to adjust the switch as it was positioned between the top of the point motor and the base board underside!
Yes, is the simple answer!
I have used the PL10 type point motor on the PL-12x adapter base with the PL-13 accessory switch (or PL-15 Microswitch) on top and then hidden them in removable track side buildings.
This is done to good effect on my Westdorf layout. Some have 'wire in tube' extensions to go in groves under several lines to operate points away from the buildings that hide the motors.
I use a 1/4 (6mm) plywood trackbed. I also extend the fixing holes in the adapter base to give a bit of adjustment, but once adjusted and secured they have lasted very well indeed.
As well as for 009 I also use the same set up on the standard gauge part of the layout that has fully automated passing loops where the points have switched literally thousands of times over the years. These have double stacked Pl-13 accessory switches for the signalling, that although not recommended by Peco has worked very well.
I think we've all been talking about the older Peco point motor but a quick look at their new "Twistlock" motor is also able to be mounted above board according to their blurb. Interestingly it would seem that it's easier to set up under the board as well, the set-up coming with a template to make things easier, so maybe Ian doesn't have to abandon under board point motors after all!
https://peco-uk.com/products/twistlock-motor
Quote from: Hobby on November 30, 2020, 12:07
I think we've all been talking about the older Peco point motor but a quick look at their new "Twistlock" motor is also able to be mounted above board according to their blurb. Interestingly it would seem that it's easier to set up under the board as well, the set-up coming with a template to make things easier, so maybe Ian doesn't have to abandon under board point motors after all!
https://peco-uk.com/products/twistlock-motor
Yes easier, but at a price!
With the optional PL-1005 microswitch for frog polarity one point works out at £21.50.
Using the PL-10, PL-12 and PL-15 accessory switch works out at £15.71 for one point.
That is at full retail price, you may be able to get all cheaper.
There are some 009-ers around who aren't too worried about price these days, Brian, just look at the number of them that use DCC! I'm fine with fettling my own stuff, in fact I'm such a cheapskate that I don't use point motors (I spend the money saved on locos!!) but some people do like the convenience and for some the fact that the new ones have been designed to fit easier will be worth the extra and six quid isn't all that much!
Quote from: Iain Morrison on December 03, 2020, 12:52
I now use these as surface and below baseboard
MTB MP1 Point Motor - dcctrainautomation.co.uk (https://www.dcctrainautomation.co.uk/mp1-point-switch.html)
everything built in and very reliable - much better than the the Peco lashup to get switching, plus it is very adjustable for throw and position.
That looks like a good product.
Brian Meldon
My dream motor would take power and the DCC signal from the track, and operate with a DCC command, slowly and quietly, while feeding the relevant polarity to the frog - thus no wires to it at all. And it would be easy to install accurately under the baseboard, with an adjustable pin I don't have to cut. And it would be cheap....
I've tackled the accurate installation issue for my Peco PL-10E point motors with 3D printed jigs but the rest is elusive.
There is a modeller who has made his own DCC point actuators and accessory decoders that fit into the base of 'ballasted' track - and that track is tinplate 3-rail. Something of a clash of cultures!
I seem to recall that LGB points are available with motors and decoders built in, but I may be wrong.
It might have been this, which is not quite the same as it is a retrofit.
http://www.gardenrailwayclub.com/track/train-line-45-point-motor---product-review-july-2011?tmpl=%2Fsystem%2Fapp%2Ftemplates%2Fprint%2F&showPrintDialog=1 (http://www.gardenrailwayclub.com/track/train-line-45-point-motor---product-review-july-2011?tmpl=%2Fsystem%2Fapp%2Ftemplates%2Fprint%2F&showPrintDialog=1)
Quote from: Iain Morrison on December 03, 2020, 17:21
Tom,
I think you are describing the DCC Concepts IP digital motor :)
Oh, dangerously interesting!