With the Kitson completed I thought about a rather more relaxing project - just a 'quickie' although I wonder how quick this one would be. So I decided to investigate what might be done with a few battered Triang TT Jiny bodies and an equally battered but quite serviceable Arnold BR65 I have in a box. All 1960s products and nothing much to look at. Obviously this isn't a scale modelling exercise, but I'm not going to apologise!
I discussed the idea with Mick who suggested something interesting to do with them: a heavy 0-6-4T inspired by (but not a model of) the Cavan & Leitrim 'King Edward'.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhomepage.eircom.net%2F%7Eyarpie%2Fclr%2Farchive%2Farchive%2F8.jpg&hash=ce28f33b76835523a4a17372dc2e5b4a4a2bb02e)
Source: http://homepage.eircom.net/~yarpie/clr/archive/8.html (http://homepage.eircom.net/~yarpie/clr/archive/8.html)
Here is what I have - let us see if it might fit. First I photographed the chassis and a Jinty body, corrected the scale of the photos, then I did some designing in Paint.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4711.jpg&hash=8b202048a03a66fb81dc9269fcdd00e880dbf39d)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2Fsketch0.jpg&hash=42a9067dc5f21adfa8f31fca0a3cef641779117c)
Obviously the body is too short, and if I look at the prototype, the boiler is far too short. In addition, the boiler has a Belpaire box and the coupled wheelbase is too long. But I said it would be 'inspired by', didn't I?
If we splice two bodies together, we can add a short section between the dome and the firebox.
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Note that I drew lines that will help me line up the body with the top of the ballast block. This will have to be cut down as well as it must fit in the shorter tanks.
Then, if we lower the extended body on to the chassis, it will look like this:
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Despite the awful bogie and the crude valve gear, and various other details that must be changed, it begins to look a little like the old 'King'.
Compare the doctored model photo to the real thing which I scanned from the Patrick Flanagan book on the C&L, by David & Charles, 1966. The original is in the Irish Railway Record Society (IRRS) library which I hope I may reproduce on this non-public forum.
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One of the common complaints about model bashing is you cannot lower the boiler far enough to create the narrow gauge look. The boiler centre line in this case comes out about 10% too high compared with the 'King' if represented to the same size (not scale!). If we splice parts of the IRRS photo on to the model, and cut the Jinty cab down, replacing it with a slightly doctored version of the prototype cab, we get this:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2Fsketch2c.jpg&hash=b4ee5bf24066ade493c51e639d4816a7c3b6f729)
Note that the cab needs to be a bit longer, otherwise the proportions are lost even further. I also altered the chimney and the dome, but these will have to be replaced anyway.
Finally, that awful bogie must go. Since the fixed wheelbase is too long (and the rear wheels foul the ashpan), I wanted to see what a shortened bogie would look like. And I arrived at this:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2Fsketch2d.jpg&hash=af978938d7166e45ef1298e745ee8d26efaee649)
Various other details must be seen to. The Jinty splashers can be cut down and replaced by the box like structure over the cylinders and slidebars, which will make more space for the Arnold gear and hide some of the crude 1960s detail from view. A cowcatcher can be made from the Langley 'Lyn' fret.
Interesting exercise, don't you think? I think it might have a chance of succeeding. ;)
As a small distraction, here is Robert the Bruce, another Jintybash, that somehow never looked right with that bogie under the rear end. I wondered what it would look like as a 2-6-2. Here is the difference (made up in Photoshop), and I rather liked the result. I now removed the leading wheels from the bogie and will probably make up outside frames for the trucks as suggested by several contributors on NGRM.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4722.jpg&hash=71b9aed39f4ba479fb8cdbbdd741391ba5cd846b)
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Obviously there are several shortcomings even in the 2-6-2 version. The main one is the position of the firebox. If I'd used my head at the time I built this (late 1990s) I would have spliced in another section of Jinty similar to the other one I'm planning, and there might have been an ashpan dropped behind the drivers.
But again, this isn't a scale exercise.
Ted has also posted this topic on NGRM Forum. For the benefit of Society members not on there, here is the gist of my reply:
I had a similar idea of extending the boiler, when I made my Campbeltown and Machrihanish ATLANTIC/ARGYLL lookalike. I actually used a piercing saw, with fine blade, to cut around the firebox, close to the inner tank edge, then across the front of the box. I did a similar job with a second, donor, body, but cut across next to the first boiler band. I started with this second part butted against the boiler of the first body. However, I realised that this was not long enough and what I should have done was use two boiler sections from the donor. Rather than cut the second band, I used some curved plastic to piece in the space. I now had the longer boiler I required. Since the tank sides of the Jinty extend well back into the cab, it was not necessary to extend these.
This photo shows the result - you can just make out the joins, which were filled with Miliput or similar -
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Felmgatemodels.files.wordpress.com%2F2013%2F10%2Fangustop1.jpg&hash=d383575246b7d55edfb9b3bf7b187a4d42b63881)
(Photo - T Sanderson)
In Ted's application, the longer tanks are required. so his original plan is probably better.
The fact that I had a short front section of body, and a spare firebox, meant that I was able to piece these together, to make a short loco, fitted on the Fleischmann 0-4-0 chassis, with pony truck added (from RT Models etched nickle silver parts and Dundas 5.2 mm wheelset with the axle ends cut off):
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Felmgatemodels.files.wordpress.com%2F2013%2F10%2F0-4-2top1.jpg&hash=9f76197996ffed0f5f3578de27c3abe77e8a21c7)
(Photo - T Sanderson)
The joint is clearer in this under construction picture.
Also a side view -
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Felmgatemodels.files.wordpress.com%2F2013%2F10%2F0-4-2side1.jpg&hash=e89be5f94e2e603877b3ad278cac9511c9de63aa)
(Photo - T Sanderson)
I am rather please with the result so far.
Mick T commented about the "skirt" behind the smokebox; on my first two conversions - No 2 ELMGATE and No 3 THATCHAM - I used the Farish 2P compond 4-4-0 chassis, converted to 0-4-2. The large front wheels coincided with the splasher, so it was not necessary to remove this. But I thought the model would look better with the skirt removed, and the underside of the boiler continued, as there is not so much in the way as there is with the original Triang 12mm gauge chassis. Nevertheless, the commutator is visible:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Felmgatemodels.files.wordpress.com%2F2013%2F10%2Fthatchamfront.jpg&hash=2823e734ba3932cc393940669f4bb158ae403f8e)
(Photo - M Thornton)
When it came to No 1 SUSSEX, I used the smaller wheeled Pannier chassis. In this case the splashers were redundant, and more work was required to remove these, in the course of which removal of the skirt was a natural consequence. There is even less showing under the boiler in this case:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Felmgatemodels.files.wordpress.com%2F2013%2F10%2Fsussexfront.jpg&hash=33d147180acb913f22dee1c6e50ab78b2bd2e14a)
(Photo - M Thornton)
A similar method was adopted for the C&M loco, and the latest 0-4-2T.
Lastly, I agree that ROBERT THE BRUCE looks better as a 2-6-2.
Tim Sanderson
I'd say you are an accomplished Jinty basher! The boiler of Thatcham seems close to what I'm planning to do. Angus is a different kind of splice. I see you have removed the slab sides from under the boiler. It looks nice - however, I need the heavy ballast block of the Arnold chassis, which has to go in there. So I won't be able to do the same.
As you say, I need longer tanks, so I'll do a basic splice between two bodies. I'm considering though to make the boiler slightly longer so the firebox can drop behind the wheels. A curved piece of styrene sheet, or a section cut out of the discarded front end of one of the donor bodies might work.
Thanks for showing us.
Tonight I had a go at that rear truck on the 'Bruce'. I used some thin shim to make up axleguards and truck frame sides. The axleboxes are a piece of nickel silver with a tiny sliver of plastic tube glued on. Some whitemetal springs, and copper wire for the spring hangers. The truck frame sides are very thin so they are springy and they won't foul the cab steps that way. There is no space to do the same to the front truck. That would foul the cylinders on the curves, so it will stay an inside frame truck. No apologies for the cruel close-ups of a battered chassis.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4742.jpg&hash=d6e66a2efafd1b1b65e23e573f9e72cdbc79515b)
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Half an hour on, and here is the result on its wheels. Here is the outside frame truck in its unpainted state.
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I painted the truck frame red, as the frames of the loco are red, and conveniently camouflaged all the other bits black. It is a bit murky under there, but I think it can be made out. At least the bare look under the cab has gone now. The only thing remaining is to reinstate the hand brake crank under the fireman's side, which broke off. But I should have a brake crank from a wagon kit somewhere.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4763.jpg&hash=b906813ef098d66dff92ba1381f8363b1cfe1ab8)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4758.jpg&hash=11322b4f0488232fff95834ffbfefdc70b1b8210)
Done enough for tonight. Cheerio!
Looking just right!
Putting the Jinty shells to the saw
After a week full of distractions, such as having to take the sails and running rigging off my boat which is due to be hauled out soon, yesterday night I put the Jinties to the saw for the new model based on the C&L 'King Edward'. I first removed the bunker from one shell which was undamaged at the back end. This one evidently suffered a motor meltdown since the firebox top has been subjected to heat.
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Next, I cut it right through just in front of the firebox.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4792.jpg&hash=4cf1ad318c131b0dbbd893da80c0d187ce5a607c)
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I found a Roco track cleaning block was a useful tool to set up the various body parts on. Here the rear end of the cab is being removed from the bunker section. Eventually only a tab will be left standing on the cab rear and front, to glue a styrene sheet cab to.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4798.jpg&hash=f747a695afbd381af4b16a3fee2202f5fa12dccc)
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You will find I am investigating a design in which the boiler is about 8mm longer than I initially planned. This will drop the ashpan behind the wheels, but the down side it I will have two scarred areas on the boiler top where the domes were removed. I'm not yet sure whether to carry on with this.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4807.jpg&hash=86e00d2f217be77f57c76b82533c7f9d58fc72bb)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4810.jpg&hash=f298333d2f2405b16df6d0ccd436566884b8ac81)
Here is the result up to now. I think it is rather too long, so probably I will remove a section from the shell to get closer to the original idea. Despite this, the slightly brutish front heavy look of the original 'King' is already in evidence. Note that the front of the Arnold chassis will have to be cut off still. Also, I'm not yet certain about that chimney. I may have to find a narrower one. There was some adverse comment on that on the other forum which I think is deserved.
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Here is a close-up of the footplate just forward of the tanks. I cut out the splasher and a bit of footplate so I could lower the body further on the chassis. The cylinder block was cut down and in addition I cut down the lead ballast block so it fits better into the boiler. The footplate will be covered in a structure that I think on the prototype contained access to the valve chests and the front sandboxes.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4837.jpg&hash=caf89f6027d5084854d617a00e1d1c30e42a6384)
The chimney shown below is the only alternative I have at present. It's slightly too small I think but it's better proportioned. I really should have something with the CI
Yesterday I have been busy filling the gaps of the splice in the tanks of the 0-6-4. I filled, sanded down and filled again, then put on a coat of matt black:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4848.jpg&hash=72e90bba0b783b0fb48db52303e788d8c30803bc)
You'll probably agree this looks terrible. But after the filler has been sanded down and obscured by black paint, it looks like this. Better, don't you think?
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4852.jpg&hash=ea6ea40a250cdbfa45869e6c7d083fe7bddf4399)
It still has the dome and chimney I use as a temporary stand-in, and the tanks still needs a touch of wet-and-dry after the paint has dried enough. Now since I have cancelled today's hauling out of my boat due to the wet and windy weather expected, I may have time to make up and fit that cab, and look into a permanent fixture to the chassis...
Next I straightened the body on to the chassis, using styrene packing pieces. I found the chassis has a list to port the left, possibly due to wear, so I corrected the attitude of the body on the chassis to straighten it out. A piece of brass shim was glued inside the shell, curved to the shape of the boiler, that will take the mounting screw.
I printed out a drawing sent to me by Mick and found that if I reduce it to 3.8mm scale (about 1/80th scale), the proportions of the model are about right - even the height of the boiler centreline is correct. The footplate and tank tops are about 1mm too high above track, the coupled wheelbase about 3mm too long and slightly offset to the rear. The edge of the cab roof would be about 35mm over track level but I think I will allow one more mm to correct for the tank top.
Developments
I made even more progress. First, I matched the loco against the diagram sent to me by Mick. The photo below shows what I did, although the model seems a bit out of proportion. I assure you though, it largely matches the 1:80 diagram.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4855.jpg&hash=ab0993b56e6fb2767ca8a6ca4d1646fde8482e1b)
The diagram incidentally comes from a 1950s Railway Modeller issue.
I finally cut a few unwanted pieces off the chassis. The Roco track saw again proved a very useful tool:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4862.jpg&hash=d4b0cfe02e6a4bcf29722d85dd27642ae2c38cde)
Building the cab began by shaping two pieces of 1mm styrene, cutting out the spectacle windows using a paper punch and rounding off the roof edge. This has a 2mm curve, which was drawn on in pencil using the bottom of a spray can. The surplus was snipped off with scissors. Next I filed the two pieces to shape and fitted them on the body shell. The old cab remnants were largely removed and I needed some filling pieces of styrene and an overlay to make a better bond of the rear sheet to the body shell. An 8mm wide strip was used as a backbone to stabilise the cab.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4864.jpg&hash=b2fd36a90fc88db8e473067df6e4a153a3e5e3e1)
Next, a thin piece of styrene was used to draw the cab sides upon. The doors on this cab are slightly further towards the rear end than those of the real 'King'. They have to match the walkway between the tanks and the bunker. The window is approximately in the right place. The rounded corner holes were drilled first, then the cuts were made in the sheet and the windows filed to shape.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4868.jpg&hash=cd2320f0a4f7b6cf158afa5b6e6d17af9b639446)
The coal rails of the bunker (which are pure LMS, nothing like the bunker of the 'King') were cut away slightly to accommodate the cab sides which were glued to the cab front and back, and to the tanks and bunker. Note the too-small radiused corners to the cab sides where they join the tank and the bunker.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4873.jpg&hash=06b765dc22b08bcfa5555165aff0d478918aba87)
The radiused edges to the cab sides were fitted with beading, using styrene strip. Some more of the coal rail had to go. Here is the result.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4879.jpg&hash=15ded8a5620feaff419a6fb095f360843d706fbe)
Note the slightly recessed cab front and rear. This conforms to this prototype photo:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhomepage.eircom.net%2F%7Eyarpie%2Fclr%2Farchive%2Farchive%2F8.jpg&hash=ce28f33b76835523a4a17372dc2e5b4a4a2bb02e)
http://homepage.eircom.net/~yarpie/clr/archive/8.html (http://homepage.eircom.net/~yarpie/clr/archive/8.html)
And here is the cab rear:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4882.jpg&hash=dc0225a02355511503211670e5fb1d921a345177)
Finally, I fitted buffer beams.
Next will be the cylinders and the covers to the top of the footplate.
Ted, this is looking really excellent! A very convincing piece of work. Well done!
Thanks, David. We're making progress!
Cylinders!
Today I got myself a length of 6.5mm aluminium tube and I made up the cylinders.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4893.jpg&hash=7446654b46e4d6a220d07d33f8a847ff70844d25)
The cylinders were cut from the pipe by taking out a 90 degree slice. Then a 9mm length was cut and a tiny bit was taken out to clear the top of the cylinder block.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4888.jpg&hash=fdecca6f2f273f7ca12d3933c2d390e6a99e3366)
Note that I made a start with the covers on the front footplate. They still need a side sheet to disguise the fact they were built up from layers of 1mm styrene.
In addition I prepared the bogie and fitted couplings. The bogie is an old Rivarossi coach bogie, fitted with larger wheels and a lead ballast block. A swing link must still be added. The coupling comes from another bogie and has been fitted by splicing onto the existing frame.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4900.jpg&hash=9af6a4d4dd9933b12bb4722c992b3033a94cae18)
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Here is another photo, though a bit hazy, showing the impressive front end. Note that I took off the black paint - it simply dissolves when wiped with a rag with white spirit, probably because it's short on curing agent.
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trial run!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENVijWcVTs8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENVijWcVTs8)
The loco took a 12-wagon coal train and the six-wheel brake van uphill comfortably. Still many details to attend to, but it does work all right.
Well done Ted, it's been a very pleasurable read, with your usual very descriptive narrative and photographs.
Keep up the good work.
Kind regards,
BrianT.
An excellent piece of footage Ted; well done! Can't wait to se the completed loco! Running the L&TR on a regular basis again but the locos are beginning to stagger so I think it's about time I had another decent session cleaning track and wheels! (Nick Robey once called me "a compulsive wheel-cleaner"!) ;D
Thanks David - think of fitting a Relco and the dirty wheels will be a thing of the past as long as you run the layout every few days.
How's the new hip, Brian? Hope all is going well.
After a remark made on the other forum concerning the empty space between the drivers and the bogie, I had a go at building an ashpan.
I have made an approximation of a funny frame behind the last driving wheels of the prototype 'King', which I suspect is part of the firebox carrying structure. The ashpan on the prototype is rather short and wide - almost an afterthought, which of course suits me fine. The parts I used for this bit of detail are 1mm styrene and some old Vollmer rivet plates used for bridge building. I save literally everything...
Here is the result, which of course shows another defect: the lack of a frame under the cab! And the bogie still has to be detailed. In this country however we have a saying that Cologne and Aachen weren't built in one day!
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4910.jpg&hash=8683b8fd4b315ed6888f70bf85bd2ef990294619)
From a slightly different angle the lack of a frame under the cab isn't evident though. It starts to look remarkably like a 'King', I think...
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4915.jpg&hash=0bc30ae7bc57796b366faf5a4460be787a31f85c)
Hello Ted,
The hip is doing alright at the moment thank you, a bit frustrating 'cos I can't do much other than sit here, with a few exercises occasionally to break up the boredom ::)
Looking forward to resuming more building work on Glen Ogle, and running my new radio controlled loco up and down the Glen. :)
Kind regards,
BrianT.
Good to hear, Brian - watching NG railway videos will help as well!
Late yesterday, after some remarks made on the other forum about the inclined cylinders and slidebars of the jinty bash, I managed to straighten the slidebars a little by melting them into their nylon supports fitted to the chassis. This improved the looks of the loco. No photos yet.
After a time, when you are putting together a loco from different sources and materials, it starts to look like the patchwork it really is. At some moment the time is there to put primer on and see what it will really look like, and where you have to do some work to improve the finish.
Today I sprayed the body in an undercoat of light grey, and painted the chassis, cylinders and wheels very dark grey. In addition I temporarily fitted Mick's chimney and dome which arrived in the mail today. Here is the result, still showing some painful blemishes on the tank sides and a split in the smokebox door. This is the wrong pattern anyway, but again - it's not a scale model. Mick's chimney is quite close but perhaps the dome is still a fraction too tall. We'll compare with what's in the other package that is on its way to me from Garry.
There is a lot of detail to be fitted still - better safety valves and a whistle, the steps to the footplate in front of the slidebars, handrails, etc., but I think we are getting close now!
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4929.jpg&hash=1ff5a4296c076cc84dc2925c7d7a5a24794639da)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4925.jpg&hash=e30625e92c400bc4271416012cdce2909a563c3e)
Ted
Another super model Ted, you are probably putting many of us to shame with this and the Kitson. I am struggling to paint a Paul Windle loco though I'm doing other things at the moment.
Keep up the good work and inspiration.
Roger
Having seen your work I don't think I can put you to shame, Roger. ;D
Very nice Ted, nothing a little more filler won't sort, and the chimly looks better proportioned too.
Thank you for sharing this with us.
Kind regards,
BrianT.
Thanks, Brian - look what I did since your post.
A few rather weird days have passed since I posted my last. On Saturday we had to take my aged mother to hospital after a fall and I'm glad to say she is doing better than expected. Tonight I finally had some time to myself again, and I did some work on the Jinty bash.
Gentlemen, the King!
Several improvements have changed the looks of the loco. I will first show a photo of its present state which is rather more like the 'King' than I would have dared hope.
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The first improvement is a dome from the package sent to me by Garry. This is slightly smaller than the one sent by Mick and it had an internal bore which I drilled through to the top. The fixing screw of the body is directly beneath the dome. In addition I did some work to level the body on the chassis. It had a list to the left, probably due to the position of the fixing hole which was a little to one side.
I also cut down the detail on the LMS smokebox door, removing the raised number and shed plate, the handrail and the door clamps. A central firebox dart and screw will be added later.
You will notice the lining on the primer coat which is similar to what I did on the L&MVR Kitson. I have a photo of the real 'King' in a similar guise which makes it easy to compare. The joint in the Jinty body is a bit prominent along the footplate - the old shells apparently have distorted a little with age.
Next was the cowcatcher, which is a Langley Baldwin specimen. This is made up without the centre bars to clear the coupler. This was copied from Robert the Bruce. Here is how I made it up:
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The frame was modified as shown - later I even took away the remaining stub inside the pointed edge of the bottom frame.
Then it was folded up and test fitted on the loco:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4950.jpg&hash=2bd049b3c7aa8474789ca2d4a0d22a2b0e173752)
The second part of the cowcatcher consists of a cross beam and inclined bars. The folded frame is folded slightly back, then the cross beam is soldered in place. Next, the frame is folded back to a right angle and the bars are folded up at the same time:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4953.jpg&hash=9877f77c61bd675272d539c60b9fd7e7a24e3815)
Note that in the above photo there are still two bars that need to be removed. The cross beam will be cut back to the edges of the slot in the frame above. This will produce enough space for the coupler to peep through. Here is the result:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4955.jpg&hash=1a3466438f0cb1afc8657a1a5280f17a0e4a0244)
The cowcatcher is fitted to the chassis, not to the buffer beam. The latter slides behind the cowcatcher frame so the body shell can still be taken off. The cowcatcher is fitted to the chassis using thin brass strips folded along the coupler pocket and the stem attached to it, under the loco frame.
Next was fitting a headlight. Originally the C&L locos were fitted with huge oil-burning headlights, and the photo of the 'King' in works grey which I have shows it fitted with one. Here is how I made it up. First I fitted a high power LED in front of the chimney by drilling two tiny holes through the smokebox top. The 1K resistor and connecting wires are concealed in the smokebox, and the LED stems are glued in place.
The headlight housing was made up of styrene, with a 1mm section of aluminium tube for the glass rim. The LED lens was sawn off and the remaining front surface varnished. The back of the LED was painted black, as was the interior of the plastic light housing.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4958.jpg&hash=2ba1dab061bf06e2887b976ada9a749aa7b53810)
The end result was shown above.
The model is a bit shorter than the prototype - I think my initial idea of having a longer boiler wasn't too bad, except for some reason it didn't look good. Here is a comparison between the semi-freelance model and the prototype. The prototype photo came from the Cavan & Leitrim book by Patrick Flanagan which I mentioned above. I think in editing the two together the prototype photo looks a bit taller than it is in reality. This is a long, big loco.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2Fcomp.jpg&hash=944d8322a4fb5cde6378d644af431828458fb1fd)
Hope you like the result.
It was worth waiting for Ted, very very well done, a masterpiece of modelling from very little.
Informative, understated and extremely educational, I love it.
Kindest regards,
BrianT.
Thanks Brian.
Obviously the model isn't completed by far, but at least it shows building a loco from simple sources isn't difficult. In a model like this you have to shut an eye to various deficiencies. I simply used the old chassis I had available, but a far better one might have been a Farish 4MT.
The running gear is very crude - new connecting rods and some sort of valve gear might be fitted using etched components for instance. In addition there is a lot of wear in the chassis that can be reduced using brass shim in the journals. When it runs you actually see the wheels wriggle as the coupling rods do their job. But it is smooth to operate so for the moment I'll leave it.
The model itself needs various details. There are what looks like sandbox fillers behind the smokebox of the prototype. What I initially took for sandboxes on the footplate actually is the covers for the valve gear. The bogie needs to be detailed, and handrails, better safety valves, a whistle and a blower pipe added. Cab interior will be basic since there is a huge motor in there that at the moment is taped down. I will stick it down using silicone sealant. Finally there is the question of painting, name and number plates. Nothing decided yet on that account.
Superb Ted, Superb! Well done - it's a very nice representation of the prototype and, as has been said, a source of inspiration - if not to do something similar, then just to do SOMETHING!! Thanks!
As for track cleaning and Relcos, I've never been sure about them. Some people love 'em and some hate 'em, I know. I've always wondered about the interactions of Relco, ECM Compspeed controllers and small motors. But I digress...
David, Ted
A quick comment on Relco 'track cleaners' if I may. I have had one or two to hand for many years to go the G&WR, Tan-yr-Allt and any other layout for that matter. None have ever been fitted or wired in on any layout. The good running achieved is down to clean track, clean loco wheels and clean rolling stock wheels. It is amazing how much dirt accumulates on wagon/coach wheels and then deposited on the track. It does vary from one exhibition to the next.
Ted, another super model and again many thanks for sharing your exploits with us on the forum. If someone does not get any inspiration and have a go themselves then they should be ashamed. What you have done is not rocket science but a plain old common sense simplistic approach to have an authentic model to run on the C&D.
Well done
Roger
Thanks, Roger and David. If someone sees this and says 'I can do that too', I would be glad. Even if you use the unmodified Jinty body on an N gauge chassis, modify the cab and detail the model, you have built your own loco.
Regarding Relcos, if I run trains regularly, I hardly have to clean track. I should switch them off for some time and see about the difference.
Today the manufacturers, Robt. Stephenson & Co, demonstrated the new 0-6-4T ordered for the C&DR. The loco worked a trial train of two miner's carriages, 12 empty open wagons and a brake van uphill to the colliery.
Although the loco ran very well, the suspension needs to be seen to due to excessive 'nosing' of the engine. Pulling power and steaming were very satisfactory.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVP1_Ooe7c8 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pVP1_Ooe7c8)
In the photo below, Lord Dunalistair is seen inspecting the new engine (which is still in works grey) at Rae Bridge, comparing it to the older 2-6-2T 'Robert the Bruce'. His Lordship hasn't yet decided on the final paint scheme, but he has been heard muttering something about dark green.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4969.jpg&hash=6e2629688f14289ad2f5e3c0568d04c27c8ce598)
Developments!
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Today I started painting the loco, after some detail work done yesterday and today. As promised it is dark green, with red buffer beams. No lining yet - i'll have to let the stuff dry properly first. The tank tops, footplate and smokebox are anthracite black.
The detail I added consists of the following. I first added proper frames to the bogies. These had to be ultra thin, so I made them of paper, with the rivets embossed from behind. The springs are whitemetal, I think from a Chivers kit. I had only 3, so the fourth had to be copied in styrene. I'm proud to say the difference cannot be seen. Here is a photo showing the result:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4986.jpg&hash=70a02d593333a323f2fa9b8795f3128f379f9bf2)
I also added vacuum pipes (Nine Lines L&B ) and better tank fillers. These were made up from styrene. The covers are meant to flip up and fold towards the dome, with a hinge on the inside. I added tank vents made of aluminium tube just in front of the cab and brass safety valves. There are smokebox door handles made up of fine wire.
There is no whistle yet and no piping and handrails. I found cylinder cock rods which were taken off Atlantic as they fouled the lineside. These will fit comfortably under the cylinders. No lining yet, no numbers and various other details are still waiting to be added. But the end is nigh! I rather like the livery and that front view which is very colonial, don't you think?
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4975.jpg&hash=ada07da228243e04ed28df680d142b9a20f5247f)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4987.jpg&hash=03f2392128cac0d75405aec0a78c4b94fe367bcd)
Excellent Ted! That is exactly the shade of green that I imagined for this loco. It looks both colonial and Irish - as it is supposed to!
One tiny comment. The front view and overhead front view photos seem to show that the cowcatcher frame is listing to starboard from the buffer beam. Is this camera close-up distortion or a flaw?
Mick
No. It's a flaw. I still have trouble fitting the body squarely on to the chassis. Part of the trouble is that the Jinty shells are rather warped with age, so I think I won't be able to straighten it completely. It can be improved though. Probably when I paint the rest of the buffer beam red it won't be too apparent.
That's what I thought may be a solution. Didn't want to mention it on ngrm-online in case it generated mass hysteria and panic!
I've sent a possible lining suggestion by email
Mick
;D
I just lined the loco black, with a thin red stripe along the footplate. Photos soon.
So the lining has been done, apart from a few things that need to be touched up and me forgetting the boiler bands!
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4992.jpg&hash=57af6da10f950488fed7a90deb3c814dd247a0a9)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4993.jpg&hash=0719d44895ca2bb7f16fab11a93b3f89fd4c2605)
Now for the final detailing, adding a whistle, blower pipe, handrails, windows, bars over the rear portholes to keep the coal away etc.
And I have to fix the wires to the LED or devise some contact springs instead. A wire has broken due to repeatedly taking the body off the chassis, and we cannot have that, can we...?
Here are some photos of the power transmission to the LED which I rebuilt tonight.
First an unkind close-up of the chassis. The black thing in front of the ballast block is the cut down cylinder block extension which carried the lamp that shone through a plastic light guide in the Arnold model. I modified the springs for the lamp socket and fitted phosphor bronze springs. The lower one sticks out of the hole in the former lamp socket. This is soldered to the thick brass lamp contact screwed to the chassis and is connected to the left hand rail (i.e. negative in NEM standards). The upper one is superglued inside the cut down top of the block. A tiny wire can just be seen coming out of a hole in the side. This goes to the pick-up spring assembly bearing on the right hand wheels.
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Next the interior of the smokebox. The legs of the LED were cut down. The negative leg of the LED carries a 1K resistor, the other leg of which has a contact pad soldered to it. This bears down on the short spring connected to the left-hand rail seen in the photo above.
The small contact pad in the depth of the smokebox bears on to the vertical spring in the photo above and therefore is the positive. So if the loco travels forward, the LED is lit.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_4999.jpg&hash=de04471c110c007fd8847daa7ebf748355fbe3b9)
Fitting this and setting the springs correctly took me some time, but it now seems to work and I can take the loco apart and reassemble it without contact being lost. Phew!
A superb piece of work Ted -the colour's about right and she's looking quite a brute! As you say, delightfully colonial.
Then perhaps you like the latest photos!
Details
I managed to do some detail work over the past days. Not all has been completed, but it makes quite a difference.
1. The boiler bands have been put on, just strips of paper cut from a scrap that had been painted black. These are fixed using satin varnish, but for the sharper curves around the Belpaire firebox edges I had to use Mick's method of PVA glue. After drying I varnished the boiler top and all traces of the white paper edge disappeared.
2. As you may have seen, the Nine Lines vacuum pipes were glued on previously, the front one stuck inside a hole drilled in the buffer beam.
3. The next thing to do was fit a blower pipe to the right hand side of the boiler and smokebox. Contrary to usual practice (they are normally painted) this is polished brass as it helps relieve the sombre livery. I bent it to shape and fixed the end into a hole drilled in the smokebox.
4. The handrails around the cab are on the outside, not on the inside of the doorway as in the real 'King'. The reason is twofold: the doorway is too narrow, and the handrails can be put on more neatly on the outside. I bent them to shape and melted them into the plastic sides using a soldering iron. Around the boiler and smokebox I fitted a handrail on brass knobs which obscures the moulded handrail and (I think what is) the push-pull motor fittings of the Jinty. This works better than cutting them off first due to the risk of damage. All handrails are brass. They might have been steel, but I decided on brass as it looks better on the loco.
5. A small whitemetal lamp was fitted on the bunker. In addition I lined out the bunker rear which hadn't yet been done. A brass whistle was glued to a piece of aluminium pipe and a short length of wire that was fitted behind the safety valves. The latter incidentally are behind each other, not side by side as in the real 'King'.
6. The windows were glazed. Rims were not fitted as the prototype doesn not have them either. Finally, but this isn't apparent from the photos, I added some detail in the cab. There is a brake stand against the bunker on the left. I fitted a piece of firebox cover from a discarded Jinty shell to the cab front, added a regulator handle, two N scale buffers above it for injector valves, and a slice of brass tube to represent a pressure gauge.
7. Some etched brass bars were fitted over the rear windows, and some real coal glued in the bunker.
I had to clean up the tank sides with some white spirit as the varnish had become dull through handling the model, then re-varnished them. I'll leave the loco as it is for a few days before continuing the detail work. Here are some photos.
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(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_5010.jpg&hash=215c6821c020349b8c9553c8a87e4b6b982f5167)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_5015.jpg&hash=a92912a6462544d5b0db187eec887322be33ca32)
This top view shows some more detail.
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Saturday an envelope from Narrow Planet came in the mailbox containing this:
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As can be seen I immediately painted the background to the lettering. The plates are beautiful, very clearly etched.
It took me till a few moments ago to fit these to both the Jintybashes.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_5753.jpg&hash=405d185740595b03b4694b6f358e401623f446c8)
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At a distance they look well enough. However, when I examined a close-up of Brutus, I found there was a lot of dust clinging to the side I had photographed. Worse, it had attached itself into the varnish surface. This will therefore have to be rubbed down lightly, and re-varnished. Warts 'n all, they say! Just to show you something occasionally goes wrong in Rae Bridge works....
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'William Wallace', as I baptised the 0-6-4T, looks better at close quarters. It isn't perfect but I think it will do:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.009dutch.nl%2Farchive%2F2013%2Fgallery51%2Fimages%2FIMG_5763.jpg&hash=6e7912851c39f8c285ca494aa8cef28fc296f771)
Why William Wallace? Well, since the other big Jintybash is named 'Robert the Bruce', I thought this a fitting companion!
Merry Christmas, you all - I'm going down now to chat to my sons who are arriving one by one!