Does anyone know if their are any kits for small 9mm gauge mine tubs? I am making a small mine and am currently using a u-skip. I am thinking of switching to a mine tub because it would be more accurate, but the Roco mine hoppers are too big for my layout, which is a very small drift mine.
Try using the mine tubs from the tramway collection from Blackdog mining.Although designed for 09,the small size makes them ideal for 009.I will post a picture as soon as Photobucket come back online.
Or the Side Tipping Cement Hopper Wagon - Roco 34601 - may be of use.
http://www.gaugemaster.com/_upload/imgs/lrg/34877/RC34601.jpg
Black dog mine tub.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1079.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fw517%2Fderricknoble%2FDSCF1105.jpg&hash=d5cb080907f578787fffb83291be5a4e1c380da5) (http://s1079.photobucket.com/user/derricknoble/media/DSCF1105.jpg.html)
Here is a better picture of the Black dog tubs.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1079.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fw517%2Fderricknoble%2FDSCF1029.jpg&hash=ddf262a754649b9624ca9b5201744bcc1edebe2c) (http://s1079.photobucket.com/user/derricknoble/media/DSCF1029.jpg.html)
I too would dearly love to see a generic mine tub in 009 but I don't think it will happen. The truth is these things are in reality so small that a 4mm model would not work. If made in resin/plastic it would be too light, if white metal, too thick and clumsy looking and then probably too heavy, the short wheelbase would make them unstable in use, rather like the otherwise excellent PD Hudson skips, inside frames as per the common prototypes would mean a loss of pin point bearings with consequent loss of free running and the physical size of the things would require a rethink of couplings. Whew! That's all pretty negative but I honestly can't see a way round those points.
Rod
I think Brian Clark (Saltford Models) at one time in the 1980
Unfortunately, there is a law of physics which applies here. I don't know the exact figures but in principle, the ratio between the wheelbase (distance between the axles) and track (distance between the wheels on the axle) is critical. When this ratio is less than, say, 1.25 : 1, then the vehicle becomes unstable. If you've ever driven something like a short wheelbase Japanese 4 x 4 you will be familiar with this formula! So, in theory, whilst it would be possible to regauge the Busch tubs, whilst they will happily pull along the track, pushing them will be problematical. If you don't believe this try it with some of the RT rubbish or slab wagons. And at
There is an "Escher" effect going on with the three tubs on that Busch Picture. ;D The designer must have been in a hurry.
Quote from: ECMT on June 11, 2013, 07:10
Or the Side Tipping Cement Hopper Wagon - Roco 34601 - may be of use.
http://www.gaugemaster.com/_upload/imgs/lrg/34877/RC34601.jpg
These are what I am currently using. I suspect the Black Dog ones would be too long and high, as I think the Roco hoppers are. Does anyone have rough dimensions for any of these?
(Also forgot to say in original post: the mine has a very tight loading gauge and is accessed by a cable-worked incline. None of this layout is loco-worked, it is really a diorama with movement. Even a Roco/Minitrains v-skip will not fit in as there is an overhanging piece of plaster/rock, but a u-skip will because the profile of the skip is narrower. This is the same reason why they are used in real mines instead of v-skips. The length of wagons is also important as the 'mine' isn't really any longer than the wagon I am using; I have had to remove the coupler loop from one end to make it fit into a shorter space. When the layout is properly finished I will improve the look by making the mine blend into the backscene and so not look like it ends abruptly, but it already takes up the very small base of the layout. I also need to be able to weight the wagons or they don't go down the incline properly; the u-skip I am using is full of lead sheet.)
As for the Busch tubs, they are expensive to mess about with, but there are those Narobahn ones, which are similar but cheaper, and I already have some. Perhaps you could make a 9mm gauge wagon by fixing two Narobahn tubs together side by side. I wouldn't know what to do about the running gear though.
Is "hacking" one of the RT Models (ex-BAL Models possibly) wagons worth considering?
http://www.rtmodels.co.uk/rt_models_014.htm (http://www.rtmodels.co.uk/rt_models_014.htm)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rtmodels.co.uk%2Frt%2520models%25204mm%2520scale%2C%2520009%2520gauge%2520maenofferen%2520slate%2520rubbish%2520wagon%2520kit.jpg&hash=c8b50be6d3790cc40995c89d6363af3c25ec34aa)
(There are others on the same page that may be more suitable.)
The weight of whitemetal would be of benefit in your application.
Those whitemetal rubbish wagons may be a little heavy. An alternative what about trying the Meridian Penrhyn 'Fullersite' wagons. They are dropside wagons and being light weight plastic could easily be hacked and weathered into hard working mine tubs.
Roger
Quote from: GraemeD on August 01, 2013, 12:53
Is "hacking" one of the RT Models (ex-BAL Models possibly) wagons worth considering?
http://www.rtmodels.co.uk/rt_models_014.htm[/url
(http://www.rtmodels.co.uk/rt_models_014.htm)
Even though the body's not quite right, definitely worth it to get a good inside-framed chassis.
Here are some examples to see what they look like:
http://www.internationalsteam.co.uk/uk/haywooddrift2012.htm
http://www.ingr.co.uk/images/canop01_news.jpg
(They are both in the Forest of Dean as my layout is based on the mines there.)
Instead of using the RT Models rubbish wagon without the body, use their 'Generic Slab Wagon' which will give you a whitemetal chassis (weight where you need it) and metal wheels. You can then build a lighter-weight body of your chosen design without having to cut away a cast body.
Rod
Might be worth contacting Robert Thompson ('Mr. RT Models" and a Society member afaik) to see if he would supply the chassis on their own...
If you have drawings and or photos of the mine tubs someone can make a printable cad model.
I'm happy to do that for you (it may take some time though, im very buzy at the moment....).
Hedzer
Here is a drawing I have, not sure how typical it is though.
Been meaning to do it myself, but my list of possible projects is also far too long.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm3.staticflickr.com%2F2844%2F8783749992_f83c7132df_o.jpg&hash=67439090852c258f4fcf0a4d3aa3e668d20f2d62) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/28798775@N02/8783749992/)
034-vagonetto-cassa-bilico (http://www.flickr.com/photos/28798775@N02/8783749992/) by tebee (http://www.flickr.com/people/28798775@N02/), on Flickr
Tom
Thats a pretty clear drawing, i can work with that. Some pictures would be nice for some details.
A big BUT, I am typing this message with plaster on my hands, I'm renovating my home...
It may take a month or two, to be continued.
Hedzer
Danny
There are several Minitrains short wheel base wagons that might provide a suitable chassis for a DIY mine tub. For example the Trash/Log car nos. 5104/3 whose wheel base is about 11.5mm. They have outside frames though. The 009shop might have some at about
Quote from: gallopingalice on August 25, 2013, 15:05
Danny
There are several Minitrains short wheel base wagons that might provide a suitable chassis for a DIY mine tub. For example the Trash/Log car nos. 5104/3 whose wheel base is about 11.5mm. They have outside frames though. The 009shop might have some at about
You could perhaps choose any RTR wagon that took your fancy and reduce its length/wheel base, by removing a slice from the centre and gluing the two bits back together again?
I have had some time to make a quick sketch of the model.
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm165%2Fdurksz%2FScreenHunter_02Oct081550_zpsf95dd7b3.png&hash=7b987d4dd4fdcceba8febde19cd154b7578393eb) (http://s104.photobucket.com/user/durksz/media/ScreenHunter_02Oct081550_zpsf95dd7b3.png.html)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm165%2Fdurksz%2FScreenHunter_03Oct081550_zpsc48334d8.png&hash=9edf15d275962f50c5afc9022a997612681dd788) (http://s104.photobucket.com/user/durksz/media/ScreenHunter_03Oct081550_zpsc48334d8.png.html)
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm165%2Fdurksz%2FScreenHunter_04Oct081551_zpsb2bd080b.png&hash=31b8010cb779fda20e02e37e79d8bcb28fcef2f5) (http://s104.photobucket.com/user/durksz/media/ScreenHunter_04Oct081551_zpsb2bd080b.png.html)
virtually behind my Deutz omz122:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm165%2Fdurksz%2FScreenHunter_05Oct081557_zpsb994f4ad.png&hash=cc671c1fedbfee35da5aae3bddeb32c8ff398732) (http://s104.photobucket.com/user/durksz/media/ScreenHunter_05Oct081557_zpsb994f4ad.png.html)
I changed the dimensions a bid, well quite a bit, increasing the size of the mine tub by af factor of 1,5 compared to the origional drawing. if not this would happen:
(https://forum.009society.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi104.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm165%2Fdurksz%2FScreenHunter_01Oct081332_zps4c118fd0.png&hash=daf808ef980ba3e55cce8e35c45d05be1caab1fa) (http://s104.photobucket.com/user/durksz/media/ScreenHunter_01Oct081332_zps4c118fd0.png.html)
These are the smallest wheels that i know of (the roco wheels used for its H0e stock).
Please be patient, it wil take a while before this model will be available!!!!! Time is still in short supply :-(.
Hedzer